proper way to shut down engine

[slam555]

its been a difficult time for me with this plane, my instructor has more hours on it than me, and I have trust issues, I find it strange that the plane flew home without issues, and then the next day won't make power, I have called most of the A&P's around, not many have the experience with this engine, the guy I like knows a lot, but I have caught him several times on being dead wrong.

As I have said in the past, my A&P knows what I'm doing, and he prevents me from doing repairs, wrong, NOBODY has ever pointed out that the fuel shut off, should be on the dash, this is something that has been signed off from the previous A&P, so I was the one that wanted the change and while I'm, going through the engine I'll also be working on the fuel valve.

the carb is new, the mags ran once after they were installed, so its timed correctly, my compression testor is on its way, I know how to do it. again the A&P will be online or there
as I've been researching this with the 85 continentals, and sticky valves seem to be a issue,

hopefully tomorrow I would like to remove the bottom plug of the carb, if it leaks fuel, there shouldn't be anything wrong with it, like I said its new,l that leaves the idle mixture screw in back of the carb, which might have to be richened up a bit, due to the fact it not a new engine I really think I'll be finding the problem in the front 2 cylinders, 3-4 Cylinder 3 has been replaced twice. which I didn't catch when I went over the logs, so I'll know what is wrong and we'll have to see this weekend, right now its compression then scope it to have a good look inside

at least I can get it ready for spring flying, Febuary is the worst month here, and I had it planned for a lot of repair time, just not on the engine.

I belong to the Boliver EAA, they're a bunch of great guys to get to know, and they focus, on experimentals, kit plane builds, not so much restorations, so I've been considering seeing if some of the other chapters might be more helpful on the continental 85,

There is one thing though, I'm having trouble grasping, throughout my learning experience, aviation has always had tight standards, on upkeep for a plane, annual inspections, AD's , and just the scare tatic, of not doing whats correct, but while looking at planes to buy and seeing other peoples planes, how they are kept, treated, or mis treated or poorly repaired, and or discarded, not to mention the stories, on flight where they were lucky to have lived through the flight, and have to wonder wheres all these tight standards for the small GA aircraft.
out of the 5 or 6 planes I seriously looked at, 2 had all the AD's done, 4 flew but were not safe. one engine quit on landing durring the inspection and they couldn't restart it. I can only wonder what the new Mosaic rules will do

rest assured that my plane will have the AD's covered, Thanks for the info guys, always like getting on this site to talk with people on this plane, I'm hoping to find a few of you at some fly in's

[3Dreaming]

You don't need a compression tester to find a stuck valve. You can tell there is an issue by just pulling the engine through just like trying to prime it prior to starting. If a valve is stuck you will not have the resistance of normal compression when pulling the prop through, and you can hear the hiss come from the exhaust pipe.

[slam555]

compression test will verity all cylinders are within spec, for the annual, and give me the info I need to get this engine running, low compression can be a valve, but it can also be rings, if its a valve we can lap it, if its rings we need to replace it, bore scope will show me how its wearing, the valve should have a bullseye on them, since I know spark and timing are good, fuel and compression are the last things to look at

[Robert Lees]

Bless you, and good luck. Please don't ignore the advice above, which you seem to be doing.

[3Dreaming]

compression test will verity all cylinders are within spec, for the annual, and give me the info I need to get this engine running, low compression can be a valve, but it can also be rings, if its a valve we can lap it, if its rings we need to replace it, bore scope will show me how its wearing, the valve should have a bullseye on them, since I know spark and timing are good, fuel and compression are the last things to look at

A compression test will not verify that all cylinders are within spec, it just gives an overall idea of the general condition of the cylinder. What I was saying is that you can get the same general idea from pulling the prop through by hand. I know you don't know anyone here, but everyone who has posted has done so trying to help you. You don't seem to appreciate the help, and come across as argumentative. Maybe that is not what you intend, but at least that is how it appears to me.

Let me introduce my self. I am Tom Baker. I have been an A&P mechanic since 1983 and IA since 1990. I have been flying and working on Taylorcraft since 1986. I maintain my fathers Taylorcraft https://inspire.eaa.org/2019/11/13/t...t-is-for-toms/ I restored this Taylorcraft. https://issuu.com/vintageeaa/docs/va...no-10-oct-1994 I restored a Clipwing Taylorcraft that's in my avatar. I own two other Taylorcraft, and am working on the restoration of an A model Taylorcraft with a Continental A-40 for my dad. I've worked on A-65, A-75, C-75, C-85, C-90, and O-200 Continental engines through the years.

[Ragwing nut]

where are you located. maybe someone knows someone in the area that can look at the engine and help rather than you just throwing money and guesses at it.

[slam555]

I'm in south west MO It would be nice to have someone, look at it, others have only said general stuff, others are totally wrong, with just what I know and the research I've done.
other know some things, but are totally clueless on others. My problem is that I know enough to get into trouble, but not enough to get me out.
for instance, like I've said previously, I wanted the fuel shut off on the dash, others in this forum agree, NOBODY who has looked at the plane, has even mentioned it.
I was told my carb has an accelerator pump on it. MY carb is the stromberg carb. no accelerator pump on it, but if it was the marvel pump, not only would it have the pump, but also a fuel shut off wit the lean mix.
Someone that is fully familar with the c 85 engine, knows where to look, what to look at, and the sources to fix it is worth his weight in gold.
ANy help or advice is taken, and greatly appreciated, I have the manuals for the engine and the plane.

[slam555]

A compression test will not verify that all cylinders are within spec, it just gives an overall idea of the general condition of the cylinder. What I was saying is that you can get the same general idea from pulling the prop through by hand. I know you don't know anyone here, but everyone who has posted has done so trying to help you. You don't seem to appreciate the help, and come across as argumentative. Maybe that is not what you intend, but at least that is how it appears to me.

Let me introduce my self. I am Tom Baker. I have been an A&P mechanic since 1983 and IA since 1990. I have been flying and working on Taylorcraft since 1986. I maintain my fathers Taylorcraft https://inspire.eaa.org/2019/11/13/t...t-is-for-toms/ I restored this Taylorcraft. https://issuu.com/vintageeaa/docs/va...no-10-oct-1994 I restored a Clipwing Taylorcraft that's in my avatar. I own two other Taylorcraft, and am working on the restoration of an A model Taylorcraft with a Continental A-40 for my dad. I've worked on A-65, A-75, C-75, C-85, C-90, and O-200 Continental engines through the years.

I look at and appreciate all the advice, given to me here, and you seem to be the guy to talk with, we did pull the prop through and did a home made compression on the engine, all 4 had compression, the 2 in the rear were better than the fronts, the engine did run after we installed the mags, guage said 50 on the rears and 30 on the fronts, but this was nothing that just said we have compression. For right now it does fire. but it still looks to be a fuel issue, so I have to determine if the carb has gas in the bowl or is the needle stuck ot something clogged or out of adjustment, or is the cylinders not able to draw enough fuel in for proper combustion.
my number is 501 519 8066 if you can give me a call we can chat about the fuel valve and other things on this plane.
the final goal is to have it flying, while small things are repaired, then a recover and restoration, it won't be perfect, but it will be a head turner

[Robert Lees]

...

hopefully tomorrow I would like to remove the bottom plug of the carb,...

(my snip)

Please don't do that; if it's a Stromberg you may damage it. The square-section bottom plug has probably never been removed since it was built.

[slam555]

ok I need to see if the bowl has fuel in it, the bottom plug if accessible, would get me this answer, remember the only fuel that engine got on the last try was from the prime, as soon
as I stopped priming, the engine didn't fire.
its a new carb, and if you've ever replaced that carb you know what a pita it is so please tell me how would you check to see if the carb is pushing fuel, and please remember it doesn't have an accelerator pump so pumping the throttle does nothing

[Ragwing nut]

I'm in south west MO It would be nice to have someone, look at it, others have only said general stuff, others are totally wrong, with just what I know and the research I've done.
other know some things, but are totally clueless on others. My problem is that I know enough to get into trouble, but not enough to get me out.
for instance, like I've said previously, I wanted the fuel shut off on the dash, others in this forum agree, NOBODY who has looked at the plane, has even mentioned it.
I was told my carb has an accelerator pump on it. MY carb is the stromberg carb. no accelerator pump on it, but if it was the marvel pump, not only would it have the pump, but also a fuel shut off wit the lean mix.
Someone that is fully familar with the c 85 engine, knows where to look, what to look at, and the sources to fix it is worth his weight in gold.
ANy help or advice is taken, and greatly appreciated, I have the manuals for the engine and the plane.

reach out to andy anderson, anderson aviation. he is a luscombe restoration expert and might be able to help. Tom womack I think is in that general area. DJ short is in warrensburg. I'm sure I can come up with others.

[slam555]

thanks will give them a call do you know the numbers for the last 2

[Mark Bowden]

If you suspect fuel flow issue, start your diganostics at the beginning of the process, in this case the tank.

Get a jug that can measure liquid volume. Ground the aircraft like you do at the gas pump, a wire to a metal post in the ground or building. Open the doors and be well ventilated.

Shut off the main tank fuel valve, remove the lower cowling. Disconnect the fuel line to the carb. This will verify that the valve will actually stop flow, obviously important to your orginal question on shutdown.

Put the gas line into the jug, open the valve and start a timer. Drain a half gallon, observe the flow, it should be signifigant. After you have a 1/2 gallon figure out your fuel flow in gallons per hour. You should be above 6 gph. Someone can chime in with what the minium should be with the tail down.

If you are not at 6 gph or well above you have a fuel line, valve, tank screen or gascolator restriction. The tank vents through the cork float cap.

Then move on to the carb. The Stromburg for all the people that cursing it, it is actually an ingenious design.
Even if you remove the bowl drain plug it will not clear the sediment entierely as it is above the bottom of the bowl.

As Rob stated, if you try to open it and it has not been out in a while you risk cracking the bowl. Same for the metal screen Thimble Fuel Filter big nut cap. Do NOT ever crank hard on this with a wrench. Get fuel lube or EZ Turn, coat the nut, washer and bowl and snug it up, then safety wire it back.

Have you checked your gascolator screen and the carb filter screen?

I'll try and give you a call this weekend. You will succeed, keep at it.

[Mark Bowden]

Some resources:
This is one of the best small contintental info pages... this is extremly important, I would suggest you download all of it so you have if by chance it goes away, a good winter project when snowed in.

http://www.bowersflybaby.com/tech/fenton.html

Also on this sites docs section

https://vb.taylorcraft.org/forum/taylorcraft-technical-topics/reference-documents/190778-fuel-system-installation#post190868

https://vb.taylorcraft.org/forum/taylorcraft-technical-topics/reference-documents/183309-stromberg-carburetor

[Robert Lees]

Slam,

"My problem is that I know enough to get into trouble, but not enough to get me out." That's actually a commendable attitude, so well done for being open about that.

I attach a photo of the Stromberg carb bowl looking vertically down inside it. You can see that the "drain plug" doesn't drain the lowest point (which is partly why no-one takes them out).

To reiterate Mark's post above: If you remove the thimble filter screw (the big brass one on the side), then be very careful upon reassembly, using appropriate fuel-proof thread sealant and don't overtighten (many carb bowls have been scrapped by so doing). I also attach a photo of the brass thimble filter, its washer and screw, items 19, 20 & 21 refer.

(I'm not a US A&P or IA, but I have certain UK approvals. Please ensure any of your activities are authorised by the appropriate FARs or approved by a relevant person Sorry if that sounds condescending, it's not intended so)

Rob

P1130345.jpg
Stromberg inlet screen.jpg