In search of original wing wire clips (update Jan 2026 see page 7 and later)

[Robert Lees]

Hello all:
Just a reminder, there was a previous 7-page thread on this exact subject that ran from Jan 15 2021 to Aug 12 2022. Link here:

https://vb.taylorcraft.org/forum/taylorcraft/everyday-taylorcraft-discussion/189336-taylorcraft-wire

On page 7 of THAT thread, I included an XRF analysis of samples of original Taylorcraft wire. The conclusion was that the composition was 304, but could not determine whether it is 304 or 304L or 304H due to the tiny diameter of the wire (even several pieces clustered together). My own opinion is that is is straight 304.

I don't know the significant difference between these alloys (or indeed between 302 and 304) and it probably doesn't make a huge practical difference. There is little fatigue; the strength is probably of the same or similar value. But this kind of research would certainly satisfy the requirements of a "owner produced parts" (in my opinion).

I attach the report again here.

[Mark Bowden]

Tcrafters, this is an outstanding opportunity that Kevin, through his hard work has found someone to make our wing clip wire. Big, tip of the cap to Kevin.

Caution, however, is warranted, we as a group need to contain our collective exuberance and public promotion.

I checked the Facebook group yesterday and I’m quite concerned with the comments about getting the whole universe involved and parts can be made for everyone that needs them, i.e. warbirds. We absolutely CANNOT put ads on Barnstormers or do Kick Starter campaigns!!!

The greatest, significant risk is to the fabricator. They do not have PMA to make parts for certificated aircraft. Should the FAA get wind of mass production of parts, enforcement actions can have severe penalties. Regulations are quite explicit about representing the manufacture of parts for certificated aircraft. The FAA in the past has made painful, punitive public examples of this.

No public promotions, keep it only small enough to get an initial economic batch done and that’s it. No involvement outside of the Tcraft Tribe. Growth can happen after the first batch is done.

Kevin and Marty, I would suggest you please address this in the Facebook group.

The only way we can use these parts is through the owner produced parts provision in both FAR 21.9 (a)(5) and AC No: 20-62E. This requires the owner to be involved per the AC with the provision for owner needs on a case-by-case basis. In addition, it will require that your A&P/IA accepts and endorses what was done.

We will need to follow quite specific paperwork processes, extensive order definition text and individual orders that aggregate to a reasonable initial batch and individual delivery shipments to order place holders. This will include very specific language by your IA’s log entry about supporting documentation on acceptance for use, driven by the fact we have no drawings.

Please, let’s all proceed with due caution and focused attention to meet regulations. AND not get the manufacturer in hot water. Once we get over the hurdle of the first batch then some word-of-mouth suggestions to other communities would be appropriate. This must remain a tightly controlled Owner produced part process, representation of parts produced without authorization is a clear and explicit violation of the FAR’s noted above.

Again, Kevin outstanding work! I suggest the above only to help ensure we get across the finish line. I can help with the text definitions mentioned above for ordering and log examples that we call all use, as well as alloy selection as Rob notes above.

[taylorcraft_52]

Looks like I logged back in at an opportune time. Very exciting to hear this is getting underway. Robert Lees You have my appreciation for taking over the post and keeping it updated. kevinbrooker Commendable work on making this a reality after so many years. You can put me down for 1 planes worth regardless of cost, but if the volume is good and the price is under $2 a foot, then I'll be interested in 2 planes worth.

[astjp2]

Tcrafters, this is an outstanding opportunity that Kevin, through his hard work has found someone to make our wing clip wire. Big, tip of the cap to Kevin.

Caution, however, is warranted, we as a group need to contain our collective exuberance and public promotion.

I checked the Facebook group yesterday and I’m quite concerned with the comments about getting the whole universe involved and parts can be made for everyone that needs them, i.e. warbirds. We absolutely CANNOT put ads on Barnstormers or do Kick Starter campaigns!!!

The greatest, significant risk is to the fabricator. They do not have PMA to make parts for certificated aircraft. Should the FAA get wind of mass production of parts, enforcement actions can have severe penalties. Regulations are quite explicit about representing the manufacture of parts for certificated aircraft. The FAA in the past has made painful, punitive public examples of this.

No public promotions, keep it only small enough to get an initial economic batch done and that’s it. No involvement outside of the Tcraft Tribe. Growth can happen after the first batch is done.

Kevin and Marty, I would suggest you please address this in the Facebook group.

The only way we can use these parts is through the owner produced parts provision in both FAR 21.9 (a)(5) and AC No: 20-62E. This requires the owner to be involved per the AC with the provision for owner needs on a case-by-case basis. In addition, it will require that your A&P/IA accepts and endorses what was done.

We will need to follow quite specific paperwork processes, extensive order definition text and individual orders that aggregate to a reasonable initial batch and individual delivery shipments to order place holders. This will include very specific language by your IA’s log entry about supporting documentation on acceptance for use, driven by the fact we have no drawings.

Please, let’s all proceed with due caution and focused attention to meet regulations. AND not get the manufacturer in hot water. Once we get over the hurdle of the first batch then some word-of-mouth suggestions to other communities would be appropriate. This must remain a tightly controlled Owner produced part process, representation of parts produced without authorization is a clear and explicit violation of the FAR’s noted above.

Again, Kevin outstanding work! I suggest the above only to help ensure we get across the finish line. I can help with the text definitions mentioned above for ordering and log examples that we call all use, as well as alloy selection as Rob notes above.

raw materials not a part until the owner cuts to length... so take that for what its worth. if one person compiles an order for say 30 wings, they manage the money and delivery for each owner as owner produced parts, then the maker is not on the hook for a PMA, besides nothing in a taylorcraft prior to 1984 was PMA

[slam555]

how much material is need for a standard set of wings, as it looks like I'm keeping mine and will need to recover next season

[micromegas]

Is this effort still underway? I would take a shipset worth!

[Jim Herpst]

Is this effort still underway? I would take a shipset worth!

I was very excited about it as I believe were others. Unfortunately I THINK it was given a good dose of cold water was dumped on it and cold feet for a group order became order of the day. I really do not know that . All I can do is read the chain

[Ragwing nut]

I was very excited about it as I believe were others. Unfortunately I THINK it was given a good dose of cold water was dumped on it and cold feet for a group order became order of the day. I really do not know that . All I can do is read the chain

More common than you think. Everybody says they will buy right up to the point of actually writing the check. I have tried to do several group buy deals and most fall apart when you start asking for money.

[taylorcraft_52]

Well I hope this isn't the case. Even if the cost seems high by comparison, I for one don't feel like running screws back into my wing ribs in place of wire if I don't have to. Let's try and keep the idea alive!

[Jim Herpst]

More common than you think. Everybody says they will buy right up to the point of actually writing the check. I have tried to do several group buy deals and most fall apart when you start asking for money.

I would tend to agree however it never got to the asking for money part. That part is fact as my check book stands ready and my bet is many others would come through. No ask is the issue as far as I can see which brings me/us back to why no ask ?