Aircraft Tech Support... Please Read!!

[Pearson]

Re: Aircraft Tech Support... Please Read!!

Kevin,

Have you thought of sending them a letter or an email? You could explain your side of the situation and at least let them know you meant no harm in ordering from someone else. Maybe if you included a self addressed stamped envelope, it might prompt a reply. I would keep it short and simple, offer the proverbial olive branch. Have someone else proof read it for you before sending.

[crispy critter]

Re: Aircraft Tech Support... Please Read!!

I just want to thank everyone for their comments,opinions,and input as well as a few that have contacted me personally.

I do want to go on record and once again tell everyone that I am in no way wishing anything bad on anyone. I also want to wish Jim and Dondi continued success in the future and maybe my posts will give them a reason to think twice the next time they decide to decline service to any customer(new or old) for any reason, in hopes that no one else will have to feel the hurt and confusion the way I have. However, they will have to continue without my business from now on and I will not refer anyone else to them. If someone asks me what I think of them I will tell them honestly.... about all the great service I've had in the past and the quality of thier products.....and I will also make sure they are aware of why I personally will not deal with them again.

I admitt that one really bad experience should not be grounds for no future business with each other especially after all the good service ive had from them over the years, but sometimes the manner in which things are handled are simply unexcusable and in forgetable.

[cvavon]

Re: Aircraft Tech Support... Please Read!!

Kevin, I think the thread should be left on both sites, and left to sort out what is the underlying cause of the problem. Because there is more to this then what has been brought forth on there side.

[Ragwing nut]

Re: Aircraft Tech Support... Please Read!!

I have dealt with the millers off and on for nearly 20 years and always excellent service. Sent many people there as well, always the same. I will say this when you deal with as many customers they do on a daily basis, it is enevitable there will be mishaps. As to why he went off the handle, I wont even begin to assume what set him off.

Re: Aircraft Tech Support... Please Read!!

The thread does not offend me.

[senior]

Re: Aircraft Tech Support... Please Read!!

Kevin: I see no reason to delete this thread.
I do find it dismaying that any vendor would try to turn away business or at least give a loyal customer an explanation. Obvious someone has irked him but does he not realize it may not be a customers fault! I get the impression someone from the other supply has said something that may not even be true!
I really don't like the idea of simply shutting you out by not answering the phone when all your trying to do is correct something, that's simply a poor attitude :tdown:
We cover about 3 planes a yr, I won't say where we get our material but geeze!

[crispy critter]

Re: Aircraft Tech Support... Please Read!!

Thank you for the comment Dave and I respect your opinion and understand your right to disagree with me in this matter, and most of the time I would agree with you.
As I mentioned in an earlier post, my original intention was in the hopes that it would get back to ATS and prompt Jim to at least give me an explanation but the letter pretty much speaks for itself. I am not telling people not to do business with ATS and I'm not trying to make them out to be terrible people. I'm simply stating my experience with them and expressing my extreme hurt and disappointment about how they treated me.

It is perfectly fine for people to post comments and praise for any company when they have a good experience with them and most companies will publish stuff like that, if i was on here talking about wonderful customer service is for a company it would certinly not be looked at as a bad thing. But what about the other side of things. Why is it wrong to comment on the negitve experiences we sometimes have, especially from someone that most of us would never dream of giving us a bad experience.

If the majority of y'all would like to see this post deleted please say so and I will do so. You do not have to voice your opinion publicly(or your very welcome and to post them publicly, it will not offend me and shouldn't offend anyone else in my opinion), or you can message me direct or one of the mediators. I will not be upset or insulted. Please understand I'm not trying to hurt anyone or offend anyone. I just feel that I have been done very wrong for absolutly no reason and I want people to know about it. Thank you and please don't take this personally.

I still encourage folks to continue your business with with ATS because as I have stated before, I've never had faster service,better prices, or better knowledge from anyone else in the fabric covering business and I am certinly going to miss that, but I can't do business wth someone who feels they can treat me the way they did. Just be aware that what happened to me could possibly happen to any of us at anytime. Had i been treated that way by a customer service person with ACS that person could have been wrote up or maybe even fired and that's why you won't see that kind of treatment from them(or very rare if you do). And as said before, Jim Miller was not mean to me when he called me back but he was very direct, very cold offering no explanation at all and made it clear that he did not care whether they had my business or not. That is his right, just as it is my right to publish my experience and how hurtful and confused it made me feel. Once again, very sorry if my comments offend anyone and I will delete this thread if that's what the group wants me to do. Thank you for listening....or reading I guess,lol.

Re: Aircraft Tech Support... Please Read!!

Hi Kevin,

I don't pretend to know who is right or wrong here.

I suspect that all of us have had dissappointing encounters with various vendors from time to time.

I will tell you this (even though you didn't ask ) ; It is best to handle disputes like this on a "one to one" basis and privately not in public on a forum. Kevin I also suggest that you delete all your posts about this to any forum that you have put them and give it time. It may heal over. Nothing good will come of them for you or the folks that gave you troubles.

That's what I think, hope it helps.

Dave

[crispy critter]

Re: Aircraft Tech Support... Please Read!!

Well perhaps they do the envelope work for ACS ? That would be a reason for them to get a bit concerned about you cancelling your order there ? Hmm go figure. Always heard good things about Jim And Dondi from Bruce Bixler Days till now.... On the other hand how did ACS simply "goof up" and short you when its obvious they did not have it to begin with.... my opinion.

Jim,
ACS has one person that does all of thier sewing....fabric envelopes, headliners, etc. anything they need sewn is done by this one person and I was told by ACS they have no connection with ATS.

[crispy critter]

Re: Aircraft Tech Support... Please Read!!

Thanks Rob, sorry for the poor grammar everyone one but English/grammar have always been my weakest subjects. I did go back and try to correct some of mis-spellings as well. I think it reads a little better now. Thanks again for the edit Rob, hope things are going good for you across the east pond.

[Robert Lees]

Re: Aircraft Tech Support... Please Read!!

Kevin, you'll see I've edited your text purely to add some paragraph spacing. Without, it's so difficult to read; hope this is OK.

[crispy critter]

Re: Aircraft Tech Support... Please Read!!

Hank,

I totally agree with you to some point. Up until the incident I would have defended Jim and Dondi to the bitter end. I have delt with them for more then 10 years and I can honestly say that they have been the most helpful folks ive ever known in the fabric covering world.

Also when I ordered materials I rarely ever had to wait more then a day or so for them. Always very nice and very helpful. That is why I find this soooo hard to accept. I have always treated them with the same respect, always supported them and recommended them to probably 100 people or more over the years and this is why it makes this soo confusing and painful. To say my feelings are hurt is a severe understatement.

As for the deal with ACS and why I didn't originally order my envelopes from Jim(ATS).... I was reassembling a C170B and needed all new AN hardware for the reassembly, at that time if I could've ordered that stuff from ATS I would've but ATS doesn't sell AN hardware.

Anyway, after placing my order for the hardware with ACS the lady asked if there was anything else I needed and I made a wise crack saying, not unless you have any horizonal stab envelopes in stock for a J3 cub, after a moment she said I show that we do have some in stock already made. So knowing I would probably have to wait a couple of extra days for ATS to make them i just told her to add 2 of them to my order. I then hung up the phone and called ATS to order all the other supplies for the cub repairs such as a qt of poly tak, a gallon of poly brush, a gallon of poly spray, and gallon of poly tone, 3 or 4 gallons of thinner, and a yard of fabric for a patch on the fuselage. Everything came as expected within a day or so except for the poly tone(color) which arrived a couple days later.

A couple weeks later when I started to cover my stabs I opened my fabric envelopes to find I was one short. I then called ACS and they admitted to a mistake on their end,apologized and then proceeded to tell me they didn't have anymore in stock and would have to make one which would take a few weeks because they were behind in that department. I told her to wait on that order until I could call and see if I could get one quicker somewhere else. Of course Jim was the first person I called. I explained to him what happened and asked if he could help me out. Like always he was friendly and helpful. He went on to tell me they would have to make one but would have it out to me within a week which is pretty much what I had expected before I called.

Happy as always after talking with Jim I called ACS back and told them to just refund the missing envelope back to my account, the lady again apologized for the mistake and did what she said she would. An hour or so later I received a call back from Jim at ATS and that's where everything started. What happened with ACS causing them to forget an envelope in the original shipment....I can't answer that one but they did make it right and apologized for thier mistake. Why did Jim call me back and treat me the way he did... I certinly can't answer that one either, but I made several efforts to call them back after Jim hung up on me in an attempt to get an explanation and that's all I wanted. An apology would have been great but I would have settled for any explanation whether it be that Jim was in a bad mood or he was simply pissed at me for ordering envelopes from ACS(which shouldn't be any of his business but at least it would be an understanding reason) and I would have left it at that.

Up until receiving the letter from them yesterday, all I wanted was an explanation. I was hoping that my little post on the cub forum would maybe get someone's attention prompting a call from Jim with an explanation because i know a lot folks from that forum deal with them. I never dreamed I would actually get that type of response from other folks having similar experineces, it simply never crossed my mind. However as I was saying, after receiving the letter it has made things very clear to me how they truly feel about thier customers(me anyway)and they can have all the business they want as long as its not mine! I no longer need or wish for an explanation and I thank them for the list of all thier competitors they included with the letter.

I'm not trying to tell everyone not to buy from them because I've have excellent service from them for many years, which makes this soo much harder for me to understand. I just want people to know what happened to me(and many others as i have so recently discovered)and prepare yourself for the possibility that it could happen to you someday and don't be too surprised if it does.

And if your situation is anything like mine or a few other folks I have talked to offline who contacted me privately....there will be absolutly no reason for it, no warning for it,and it will make absolutly no sense. Good luck and I hope you never have to feel the same disappointment from them that I have.

[Jim Herpst]

Re: Aircraft Tech Support... Please Read!!

I still say look at my earlier post number 4. It seems very likely since he said deal with ACS "on this deal" they either do their work OR by picking and choosing he got a bit up set....are the prices the same for the Fabric ? I agree with Hank > Lets not damage a reputation for any party. Everyone gets along to well for that !! (oh boy I still have a scar on my elbo when I tried to jump in and break up a fight when I was 10. (got rolled in a hay field over the only broken bottle on 100 plus or so acres) Think I would learn !!!!

[Hank Jarrett]

Re: Aircraft Tech Support... Please Read!!

I have worked with Jim and Dondi several times and they have ALWAYS been absolutely professional and great to work with. They are both very reasonable people and this really sounds like a misunderstanding that has gotten totally out of control. I would hate to have EITHER of you (customer or supplier) have your reputation damaged by a mistake.
Knowing the people from both sides, this just doesn't make sense.
Hank

[waltermrich]

Re: Aircraft Tech Support... Please Read!!

Thanks for sharing that , that is not the right way to deal with your customers, I will be cautious when buying fabirics in the future.