New 1940 BC65 Restoration.

[Hank Jarrett]

Re: New 1940 BC65 Restoration.

I don't know if the interior of the tube doors was covered originally but most I have seen after possibly several recovers were. I am not sure why it is a good idea. If the interior upholstery is attached to a rigid upholstery board, the whole interior of the door can be opened for inspection by removing the inside door panel.

The tube doors were very prone to rusting out on the bottom, usually from moisture that collected in insulation in the door cavity. I plan on making the interior panels removable on my 45 and taking them off every annual. The nice fitting wood doors on the 41 are really great. I want nice tight ones on the 45 too, and I want to keep them tight.

There is plenty of time to go on my 45, if anyone knows of a reason the interior of the doors SHOULD be covered, please let me know.

Hank

[Taylorman]

Re: New 1940 BC65 Restoration.

I don't know if the interior of the tube doors was covered originally but most I have seen after possibly several recovers were. I am not sure why it is a good idea. If the interior upholstery is attached to a rigid upholstery board, the whole interior of the door can be opened for inspection by removing the inside door panel.

The tube doors were very prone to rusting out on the bottom, usually from moisture that collected in insulation in the door cavity. I plan on making the interior panels removable on my 45 and taking them off every annual. The nice fitting wood doors on the 41 are really great. I want nice tight ones on the 45 too, and I want to keep them tight.

There is plenty of time to go on my 45, if anyone knows of a reason the interior of the doors SHOULD be covered, please let me know.

Hank

Thank you Hank
There is actualy no attachment points for a upholstery panel or board on the door frame so I am thinking it was covered. If anybody has pictures of the inside of a 1940 BC/BL 65 tube door that would be appriciated.
Thank you all

[Hank Jarrett]

Re: New 1940 BC65 Restoration.

Thee are two kinds of 40 tube doors (that I know of). One has two diagonal stiffeners and the other has one diagonal and one horizontal. If anyone knows which one is for which planes let us all know. ;-)
What I planed to do was make some "Adel" type clamps for the tubes and set them with a rivnut through the hole to clamp around the tube. Then I would attach the inner door panel to the rivnuts with finishing machine screws.
Haven't don it yet so I don't know if it will work, but that was the plan.
Hank

LOTS more door pictures if you need them.

[3Dreaming]

Re: New 1940 BC65 Restoration.

I think the doors on the 40 would have been fabric covered and painted to match the interior. They would not have had any upholstery attached.

[3Dreaming]

Re: New 1940 BC65 Restoration.

Thee are two kinds of 40 tube doors (that I know of). One has two diagonal stiffeners and the other has one diagonal and one horizontal. If anyone knows which one is for which planes let us all know. ;-)
What I planed to do was make some "Adel" type clamps for the tubes and set them with a rivnut through the hole to clamp around the tube. Then I would attach the inner door panel to the rivnuts with finishing machine screws.
Haven't don it yet so I don't know if it will work, but that was the plan.
Hank

LOTS more door pictures if you need them.

Hank, most of the frames I have seen were made from a "P" shaped material. This would be kind of difficult to use an adell type clamp. If you are planning on just attaching to the brace tubes I think you will have problems with the edges coming up. Also the clamps will likely show and wear on the outer fabric.

[Hank Jarrett]

Re: New 1940 BC65 Restoration.

Tom,
I am just stating a lot of research on the 40 so this is good info. If there was no upholstery that kind of solves the problem. Sure would be simpler and lighter! The clamp idea was something I was going to try on the 45 too and the idea is to make the clamp the same shape as the "P" tube and allow it to extend to the inside just enough for room to clear the machine screw. The clamp is very thin and is under the "card stock" upholstery backing material. The only thing that worried me was that the screws would be pretty far from the edges. I also considered using a strip of Velcro around the edge but the tape backed Velcro seems to have real problems with the glue turning to "GOO" over time and letting go. Maybe some upholstery clips around the perimeter under the upholstery and over the backing material?
Sure was easier on the 41. The wood doors already had spots where there had been screws before and they hold and work great! They may be hard to build but the wood doors are tops!
Hank

[3Dreaming]

Re: New 1940 BC65 Restoration.

Hank, rather than clamps I would weld tabs on before covering if you are set on an inside interior panel. You could also go ahead and cover the inside and use hook and loop like you said. No self stick though. Sew one side to the panel and glue the other to the door with something like Pliobond. I still think covered and painted to match is the best bet. Simple and lite. If you are worried about water on the inside of the door make a hole in the very bottom corner with a small tipped soldering iron. Tom

[Hank Jarrett]

Re: New 1940 BC65 Restoration.

For Josh's 40 I am doing research to go back to original and it looks like regular fabric on the inside may be the way to go. If anyone has Chet's book there is a photo of a 40 doors at the plant on pages 97 with what looks like a fabric map pouch. There is another picture with what looks like the same pouch on page 89. Anyone still have one like that? On 96 you an see where they have covered the INSIDE of the tubes in the fuselage so it would match up nice with the rest of the interior with a painted fabric interior door.
On page 94 there is what WOULD be a perfect door but they exposed the photo for Fifi D'Orsay instead of the door panel (so much for a focus on what was REALLY important in the picture!).
Does anyone have have that pouch in their door? It actually looks really handy and would dress up the door so it didn't just look like painted fabric.
Hank

[Taylorman]

Re: New 1940 BC65 Restoration.

Great info guys, so far covering the inside of the door is the way I will go.
If anyone has pictures of their planes showing the inside of a covered doors, please share it.

Thanks all

[Ragwing nut]

Re: New 1940 BC65 Restoration.

inside of doors were fabric covered.

hank, door on left is later prewar door, door on right is earlier, 38/39? right door had add on door lip edgemade from sheetmetal, more time consumin to build. Also look for pk holes where the lip was attached. Model "A" door looks similar to door on right but was made from aluminum. I have had all here at one point or another.

[ajfriz]

Re: New 1940 BC65 Restoration.

I believe mine have two diagonal and one horizontal stiffener. I plan on making mine into patroller doors though, so I'm not much help.

[Forrest Barber]

Re: New 1940 BC65 Restoration.

yes doors are covered inside. Check forumn info on stitching fin .

[Hank Jarrett]

Re: New 1940 BC65 Restoration.

Anyone have any photos of what the inside of the door looked like? I like the idea of the pouch for charts and such.
Hank

[Taylorman]

Re: New 1940 BC65 Restoration.

Not sure what I am doing wrong but I can't upload pictures anymore, I am getting this message when I try to upload even one picture, 413 Request Entity Too Large.
Anybody knows what I am doing wrong?

[dejh22]

Re: New 1940 BC65 Restoration.

I don't think you are doing anything wrong. I had the same problem when I had started using our new camera. It would produce pics that were to "large" to upload to this site. Most of the pics were over 1mb. They need to be in kb's to be the right size to upload here. You should have a program on your computer to reduce the size of the photo. What I do is right click on the pic. Then choose edit. Then it brings me to the "paint" window. In the upper left hand corner I click on resize. I change 100% to 39%. I then close that window. When I close the window it will ask if you want to save the changes. Click yes. Now the picture should be small enough to upload here.