0200 Ideal state moving on

[swoeric]

So we have decided that the next move is beyond the c-85. If we were to flush out the ideal stc for an 0200 what would we want? can an stc have more than one option such as option one full electric and option two no starter?

a list of what I have collected.

• 0200 both older model and newer light weight model included
  
• short motor mount
  
• light weight starter "Skytech" (with option to delete)
  
• light weight alternator "b&c" (with option to delete)
  
• Internal regulator
  
• no cowl modifications
  
• keeping the battery in the cabin not the tail
  
• light weight battery
  
• possibly changing to larger scott 3200 for weight distribution
  
• wing attach mods similar to harer stc
• fuel flow mods to satisfy
  
• two piece exhaust for easier removal

Is there anything left out to be thrown on the wish list?
Is there any oversight?
Those of you with experience are there some recommended structural items to be addressed whether added or deleted from harer?

[Hank Jarrett]

Re: 0200 Ideal state moving on

Skylight!
I have the parts from my 45 that were tested at the factory and never incorporated in production. Really nice because they don't use the entire "roof" so your head doesn't broil in the summer.
If you look at the crossed tubes above the headliner, there is a wood frame with glazing in the two triangles from the center of the "X" to the wing roots. The front triangle is fabric covered and the fuselage top fabric comes forward to the center of the "X". The headliner leaves only the glazing triangles open, but that gives as much visibility as a full skylight. Works and looks really nice, but only two planes are allowed to use it without the paperwork (the two post war prototypes were the only ones that got it from the factory).
Hank

[Robert Lees]

Re: 0200 Ideal state moving on

Interesting.

Of your list, I have:

• Modified C85...similar to 0-200 conversions...205 horsepower)..1280lb gross weight
• Short mount
• Starter option deleted (I have arms)
• Alternator option deleted (I have battery)
• No regulator
• No cowl mods
• Battery in cabin (but only to power radio, etc)
• Light-weight battery (2lbs)
• Don't like the Scott tailwheels, so I'll stick with my Maule
• Wing mods similar to Harer done
• No changes to fuel flow system...it works perfectly as-is
• Single piece exhaust (was two-piece, but the joint kept leaking, so welded it up)

In addition:

Retained Eismann mags (lovely things, light & simple)
Hand-held Icom ICA20 radio with external fuselage-mounted whip aerial; Flightcom intercom. Hard-mounted jack plugs for headsets.

Big Battery for those rare occasions (in Europe) I need to carry my removable transponder. This battery also backs up the radio supply.

[Pearson]

Re: 0200 Ideal state moving on

My desire for this STC would be to have a choice between a full electrical system, alternator only, starter only, or no starter or alternator.

Also, if it didn't add too much to the cost of obtaining the STC, the option of fuel injection. But I also feel that a strong slant should be given to keeping the cost of buying the STC as low as possible. So if fuel injection would require expensive testing or in any way added significantly to the cost of developing the STC, it should be left off.

I have seen many light aircraft such as Taylorcraft & Cubs with a starter and battery, but no alternator. The battery was kept charged by either a solar panel or removal each night for charging.

Regarding, "if an STC can have more than one option" the Harer STC gives three options I believe. You just specify on the master drawing list which drawings go with which option.

Go Eric!!!

[3Dreaming]

Re: 0200 Ideal state moving on

Gross weight increase to 1320 pounds.

[fearofpavement]

Re: 0200 Ideal state moving on

I think a starter option would be relatively simple. Once you get into charging systems that adds some complications. Certainly surmountable but more paperwork per pound. I think the goal should be to make the T-craft a more versatile plane without making it into another kind of aircraft. Cheap, light and simple are good. If someone wants it to do everything a Cessna 172 will then it would be better to buy one of those. I love the simplicity of the Taylorcraft (but sure do like the O-200 on it)

I, like many of you, have flown more complex aircraft and enjoyed them all for what they were but the T-craft is an airplane that seems to have more connection with "flying" than some.

[swoeric]

Re: 0200 Ideal state moving on

Skylight!
I have the parts from my 45 that were tested at the factory and never incorporated in production. Really nice because they don't use the entire "roof" so your head doesn't broil in the summer.
If you look at the crossed tubes above the headliner, there is a wood frame with glazing in the two triangles from the center of the "X" to the wing roots. The front triangle is fabric covered and the fuselage top fabric comes forward to the center of the "X". The headliner leaves only the glazing triangles open, but that gives as much visibility as a full skylight. Works and looks really nice, but only two planes are allowed to use it without the paperwork (the two post war prototypes were the only ones that got it from the factory).
Hank

how do the skylights attach my tcraft has the full skylight and screws into the wood bracing. do you have any pics. is it possible to do your version on a 337

[swoeric]

Re: 0200 Ideal state moving on

updated list of what I have collected. In Red

option one 1320 gross weight

option two 1500 gross weight


full electric

no electric


0200 both older model and newer light weight model included

short motor mount

light weight starter "Skytech" (with option to delete)

light weight alternator "b&c" (with option to delete)

Internal regulator

no cowl modifications

keeping the battery in the cabin not the tail

light weight battery

possibly changing to larger scott 3200 for weight distribution (this would only be if nessesary to keep cg )
wing attach mods similar to harer stc
fuel flow mods to satisfy

two piece exhaust for easier removal (is this worth the effort)

skylight



(are eisman mags that much shorter do they have impulse coupling?)

[lfries]

Re: 0200 Ideal state moving on

Is there a type certificate for the Ingram Taylorcraft factory LSA which used an 0-200

[Hank Jarrett]

Re: 0200 Ideal state moving on

how do the skylights attach my tcraft has the full skylight and screws into the wood bracing. do you have any pics. is it possible to do your version on a 337

My 45 was wrecked in a wind storm just before I bought it. The pieces for the skylight have been under a bed for years since then but I think all of the parts are there. There is a wood frame attached to the "X" tubes, the top longerons and the front cross member, closing in the side triangles of the "X". The front and side pieces look pretty much like the ones on my 41 with a normal headliner and fabric exterior (no skylight).

The glazing is in two triangular pieces (mostly busted up pieces in a bag under the bed). The glazing set in a rabbited edge in the wood and was held in with aluminum strips with screws into the wood. The screws didn't go through the glazing as I remember but I can check the busted up pieces to be sure.

The beauty of it is it seems so simple and there are no curves in the glazing to worry about. I was told by a Taylorcraft old timer many years ago they dropped the idea because it was too complex and there was a push to simplify the planes right after the war.

Hank

[tim]

Re: 0200 Ideal state moving on

im starting an stc for fuel injection for the 0200 and some like me want more like an 0235 im looking for that taylorcraft bush plane

and from what barnstmr said and has done for an stc for the 0200 he is the closest to it

[astjp2]

Re: 0200 Ideal state moving on

Well the first problem is you MUST modify the baffling to fit the cowling! If you retain the lord mounts....

Next, you need a good exhaust like the Cessna 150 or Aeronca Chief Hanlon Wilson stuff.

I would include a -8 option for the engine and any other mods by Dons Dream machine stc's.

You want a 75" cessna sea plane prop repitched for land plane.

Ercoupe spinner.

Skip the wing mods for no gross weight increase.

Include the prewar models.

Use my main fuel valve with an improved Steve's gascolator.

Float fittings option.

Extended Baggage option.

Cub 18 gallon tanks in the wings option.

Toe brakes like I have with a bolt on axle adapater.

Pre war rudder (6" wider for more authority)!

Fuselage mods to do the adjustable seat installation.

Flap mod?

Belly pod mounts.

I was already working on an STC for this basic combo.

I got shot down lasy year for using the M74CK-0-46 prop on the O-200, I could not afford to put the strain gages on the prop. cost was about 12K just for the test.

With all of these mods I might as well buy a super cub.....

[akndrifter]

Re: 0200 Ideal state moving on

Could it have been done with a prop approved for the F19?

[jim cooper]

Re: 0200 Ideal state moving on

I think the 0200 would be just right. I had an LSA Champ with transponder, good radio, alternator, B&C Starter, battery in rear of cabin. The BC12D needs the 0200 with those features. These updates are still pretty primitive compared to todays cars. You don't see many people hand cranking a chevy. The 0200 more than makes up for the additional weight. Aeroncas and Taylorcrafts are slow aircraft to begin with! Sit back and enjoy the trip! JC

[VictorBravo]

Re: 0200 Ideal state moving on

Those of us who have removed a one-piece exhaust can very happily tell you that it is WELL worth it to have a two piece exhaust !

The skylight is definitely an important option to include. It adds a very significant benefit for safety and comfort.

IMHO you should make it a 1320 pound gross weight. The reason is that with the larger engine, even using the light weight starter and a fairly small battery, you are going to have useful load problems at 1200 pounds. Although keeping the wing fittings unchanged is attractive from a mechanical POV, the reality is that you are talking about a minimum of an 800-850 pound empty weight with light starter, Univair struts, alternator, battery, wiring, two wing tanks, skylight, metal prop, and modern fabric/dope/paint. The 1320 pound gross will be just about right.

Another thing on your list should be a larger baggage sack. NOT the full size F-19 hall closet (that leads you down the path to a long engine mount). I'm suggesting a bigger sack that goes all the way down to the floor and maybe a foot further rearward.

Bill