Calling all 438XX Registration Numbers

[Hank Jarrett]

I brought home two tube door windows like my 45 has. The doors they were on are in the hangar but the window frames and doors are both bent up (repairable, but damaged). The tube door windows are different from teh wood door ones and the sheet metal doors and windows are different from all the others too. I do have examples of each though.

Hank

[Ryan]

March 46 would have had DZUS fasteners for the cowls. The trunk latches were introduced after May of 46 when much of the wood parts were changed to aluminum and the stringer pattern changed. This was per a factory letter in Forrest’s collection. I’m sure old stock was used up first but that is a pretty good starting point. Your plane should have wood stringers, (and prewar style pattern) wood floor boards, wood door frame with larger post war door and DZUS fasteners along with wood trim tab and wood triangle between the gear legs. HTH.

[Ryan]

Also I should say we have 43754 serial 7413 and according to the B book it’s build date was end March 46. First flew April 1 by William Crawford and was sold by April 4th.

[Mark Bowden]

Ryan, would you have a copy of the letter you referenced and please post a copy? Its a nice piece of possible restoration trivia.
Thanks.

[Robert Lees]

Also I should say we have 43754 serial 7413 and according to the B book it’s build date was end March 46. First flew April 1 by William Crawford and was sold by April 4th.

Mine was registered 23 March 1946 to its first owner before it flew 1st April 1946 at the hands of Paul Dietz (43640, 7299)
Rob

[Jim Herpst]

March 46 would have had DZUS fasteners for the cowls. The trunk latches were introduced after May of 46 when much of the wood parts were changed to aluminum and the stringer pattern changed. This was per a factory letter in Forrest’s collection. I’m sure old stock was used up first but that is a pretty good starting point. Your plane should have wood stringers, (and prewar style pattern) wood floor boards, wood door frame with larger post war door and DZUS fasteners along with wood trim tab and wood triangle between the gear legs. HTH.

Ryan, THANK YOU! That letter was in the dark recesses of my cranium as I thought something relative to that existed. Yes The wood has all been restored with new (except the floor which I may leave as metal depending.).. The cowl however is a much different story. I knew the plane had a accident around 1961 and suspected the cowl was replaced then. DZUS fasteners it will be..

Thank you again!!

[Robert Lees]

There is (or was in the early 2000's) a company in New Hampshire that supplied stainless Dzus fasteners. I think they were called D&D. I modified the fasteners by drilling a hole through from the back and countersinking the front, and then made a tool that would open them without risk of a screwdriver slipping and scratching the paint.

[woodmw]

Great idea. Thanks for sharing.

I have one 'troublesome' fastener on my cowl that never seems to lineup correctly. I think this idea would help a lot.

[Ragwing nut]

Hank,

Yes 43831 was delivered new exactly that way (do not know about the paint scheme however) Still trying to figure out the solid door glass. Probably never really know. Will go looking for some past owners descendants and see if they have pictures is all one can do.

usually only the pilot side got the sliding glass. right side was fixed.

[Hank Jarrett]

Mike, any idea how they divided up those that would get the fixed window on one side as opposed to opening on both? I never noticed that. Both of my planes have the flip out windows both sides (one set of tube doors on the 45 and the 41 doors are wood) and all the busted up and spare doors sheet metal doors in my pile have sliding windows.

Hank

[Jim Herpst]

usually only the pilot side got the sliding glass. right side was fixed.

Mike,

The strange thing on 43831 is that the solid windows were screwed in with screws from the outside. All slotted screws all very uniform in locations on both doors. The plane was delivered to the owner with every option they had at the time. Pants. ROC,T&B duel wing tanks with valves at the cabin wing root.

I just can not imagine they would have used these screws from the outside however they did many things from time to time at the factory this way perhaps? Perhaps an order? The plane did not sit after the build nor at the dealership from the registration anyway. It looks like it went straight to the owner after a day or two at Allegheny County Airport Dealership.

[Ragwing nut]

Mike, any idea how they divided up those that would get the fixed window on one side as opposed to opening on both? I never noticed that. Both of my planes have the flip out windows both sides (one set of tube doors on the 45 and the 41 doors are wood) and all the busted up and spare doors sheet metal doors in my pile have sliding windows.

Hank

I was speaking regards to post war models.

[Ragwing nut]

Mike,

The strange thing on 43831 is that the solid windows were screwed in with screws from the outside. All slotted screws all very uniform in locations on both doors. The plane was delivered to the owner with every option they had at the time. Pants. ROC,T&B duel wing tanks with valves at the cabin wing root.

I just can not imagine they would have used these screws from the outside however they did many things from time to time at the factory this way perhaps? Perhaps an order? The plane did not sit after the build nor at the dealership from the registration anyway. It looks like it went straight to the owner after a day or two at Allegheny County Airport Dealership.

I've never seen a post war door with screws through the outside skin. They had an inside piece of trim held in place with pk screws.

[Jim Herpst]

I've never seen a post war door with screws through the outside skin. They had an inside piece of trim held in place with pk screws.

Mike, I also wonder that..Kevin Lacy has one though that appears identical