Ads-b

[Jim Meeker]

Good news for Taylorcraft pilots on ADS-B requirements. Looks like we are exempted:

http://www.avweb.com/avwebflash/news/FAA-Clarifies-ADS-B-Mandate-For-Non-Electrical-Aircraft-228413-1.html

[Guest]

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Yes, good news for sure.

Dave R

[M Towsley]

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If you fly out of Class C you should be able to obtain a waiver, similar to the transponder waiver that I get yearly at my airport, to fly in that airspace. I have been in-touch with several organizations over the last couple of years, AOPA, etc., regarding this. They asked me to stay in-touch with them, as the time gets more near, to let them know how the procedure went in obtaining the waiver. Our local tower manager, (great guy), advised me the same regarding the waiver. Obviously, you don't need ADS-B if you are not flying in controlled B or C airspace.

[Scott]

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Good news, at least a t first glance.
Still a little foggy on the whole issue, especially as it will impact Canadian aircraft flying in the US.

Also wonder what it will mean in practice to have (a relatively small number of) aircraft flying in airspace where all other aircraft have ADS-B out. Depending on where you're flying and how busy the airspace, I expect ATC may be reluctant to clear the non-ads-b aircraft.

I remember flying Montreal - NY Islip shortly after Mode C became mandatory. I had Mode C but that didn't make any difference to the center controller (can't remember which center) who responded (to my second call) "VFR no time no time." Anyway a small issue perhaps, like I said depends on where and when you fly and worse case is detours.

[M Towsley]

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I have flown for over 5 years in Class C with no transponder with absolutely no problem. ATC can see you and mark you on their scopes. We have probably over 15 aircraft on our field with no transponders, but with waivers.

Actually, I think it is going to be the other way around. I think there will be a large number of aircraft that never fly into B or C who will not equip with ADS-B. There probably will be a lot of people with 'IN' just to see what's around them but my opinion is you may want to look outside for all of us who don't have 'OUT'.

[PA1195]

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Lots of chatter on this matter. Like glass cockpits and all manner of electronics it's one more potential reason (excuse?) to not "see" and avoid and let the electrons handle the problem.

Had a FAA ramp visit last week. Good conversation and one of their current talking points is controlled flight into terrain. I asked if there was any indication if it was due to the panel>visual transition taking too long, or maybe depending on the nav display to tell or make them "PULL UP". GPS nav and ADS-B might save you, or if allowed, can take you places you'd never fly otherwise.

Gary

[astjp2]

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I called SLC one time trying to get a waiver for the class B veil that I am stationed at, they just laughed and said we dont do waivers, just call out, "negative transponder, no electrical system." never had a problem....

[3Dreaming]

Re: Ads-b

I called SLC one time trying to get a waiver for the class B veil that I am stationed at, they just laughed and said we dont do waivers, just call out, "negative transponder, no electrical system." never had a problem....

You don't need a waiver to operate in the Mode C veil, for no radio aircraft it is spelled out in the regulations 91.215.

[Mark Bowden]

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Yes good news, attached is the letter.

We "old model" Tcrafts were exempt before under the original rule from upgrading because of the standing exception for aircraft certificated without an engine driven electrical system.

The issue this letter clarified was that the aircraft originally certificated without electrical that had been later upgraded to battery power or with an engine that does have an engine driven electrical system does NOT have to equip.

Also, Part 91 appendix also lists the Class B airports with Mode C veil that "no electrical system" aircraft can run around in. But you can't go into the Class B space without some sort of permission, i.e. calling ahead.

[Mark Bowden]

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Agree, head down is bad, always keep looking. But we have to balance it against looking inside at tech that is helpful and makes the flight safer. ADSB surveillance is a really good thing. I’m all about our duty to see and avoid. However the reality of seeing what is actually there, is well, call it a challenge, as we are humans not eagles.

I have been flying a Stratus 2S with IPad mini for year and a half. I fly in very busy airspace, based inside mode C veil in Kansas City. Now, in this area, I won’t fly without it…ever. Pun intended, it is eye opening.

After you fly with it, you may not want to be without it for any number of the individual ADSB capabilities.

Because I’m not ADSB equipped I only see what some other equipped aircraft sees when I’m 15 miles away from that aircraft inside that “hockey puck” space. It is fantastic information and frightening as well.

Fantastic in that you know altitude, direction, climb/decent, N#, speed, where they are and if they are on the ground. Frightening in that you cannot visually see all of them and that you can’t sometimes see them even when knowing exactly where to look when close, like in the setting sun.

We can be happy that antiques don’t have to spend money and upgrade but I would encourage everyone to try and fly in a busy environment and see what it can do. You might consider it a safety bargain at twice the price even to just get a Stratus type gadget.

Would be interested in everyone's traffic and weather comments too. Both portables as well as if you are in an equipped aircraft. You really have to learn the limits of it.

[PA1195]

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Good perspective on aids to safe flight. We in the far north are spoiled by wide open spaces and a ground that's generally not cluttered with development. Given mid-airs here are relatively rare except near congested airspace or terminals, the biggest concern is situational awareness during marginal flight conditions. Any device that would help in that condition must be useful. I have heard good reviews of the technology and did experience an I-Pad interaction on my last flight review.

For example as noted above: https://www.foreflight.com/products/stratus/

Gary

[M Towsley]

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One thing I don't understand is where are you guys mounting/placing all this equipment? What are you using for battery power to keep it all running? Obviously there is more room without a passenger but my wife and I usually fly together.

I have a portable GPS suction-cupped on the side window, Icom portable on the left side of the panel, PCAS on the dash and headset wires running up between us from the intercom. It's very chummy, just curious how you are doing this. Thanks!

[astjp2]

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I also flew under the Class B and in and out of class D and they still didn't do waivers

[woodmw]

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Why would a waiver be necessary?

[astjp2]

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Underneath the wedding cake and within class D