Pre-covering thinking...

[mhorowit]

Laying awake last night thinking about the next step after welding on the fuselage; looked like covering, so I began to think of what had to be in place before that could happen.

The large diameter fairleads need to be in place as do the phenolic cable guides. Pulleys and cables should be in place. Stringers. Am I missing anything?

Next, is there any reason I cannot reuse the old cables if I don't see any strands broken? Brake cables will go to 1/8", but they can be installed after the cover.
- Mike

[Hank Jarrett]

Re: Pre-covering thinking...

Mike,
IT is amazing how many little things will slip past you and not be seen till after the fabric is on. If you haven't had the pure joy of crawling into the tail of a Taylorcraft after the fabric is on you have missed one of the most unholy PITA experiences possible.
On my 45 I will be FULLY assembling the plane including all controls fully rigged, systems up and running and even hope to run the engine, all with NO FABRIC. I have seen others do this and just thinking of how hard some of the simple safety wiring would have been after covering made it look like a GREAT idea to me.
It is also MUCH easier to put the headliner in BEFORE you cover the fuselage. Just make sure you cover the outside of the headliner so any drips won't get on the outside surface while you put the fabric on. If you do it right you should be able to pull all of the covers out through the access holes after the paint is on.
Another thing is you can measure from known (and visible after covering) spots to where the cables will penetrate the fabric later. Locating the spot where you want to cut the fabric for the rudder cables is a real pain if you don't have a pattern from before the covering went on.
Do EVERYTHING you can to make sure all is right before you cover the airframe. This would be a good time to get your IA over to do most of his annual too. He will appreciate being able to see EVERYTHING better than he will ever see it again, all assembled and working.
Hank

[Larry Lyons]

Re: Pre-covering thinking...

Hank is right, on the 46 we just covered we had the old covering to measure but it was still a nail biter. We did it, and now do not even need to put a tear drop patch on afterwords. But it took me one evening to measure about 10 times before I melted my first slot!
Larry

[Ragwing nut]

Re: Pre-covering thinking...

Brake cables will not like going to 1/8". Leave them stock. I agree, if you have never done a particular model of airplane, fully assemble to elminate any suprises after covering

[N96337]

Re: Pre-covering thinking...

I always go fully assembled and everything hooked up before any covering. It's saved me alot of work a few times! The other consideration to that is that you cover everything at once, so your cover job is not sitting a long time compared to the parts that go next to it....such as a fuselage that gets covered one year and wings that get covered a year later.... that keeps things matching up a little better usually. One thing I see so many do is cover to silver, or even worse, not that far...then hang it on a wall while they do the next parts. That really opens the door for contamination in the system! If you do need to get one part covered before you do another, at least take it through a white color coat, then you can scuff and re-shoot all the color at once.
JH

[mhorowit]

Re: Pre-covering thinking...

I always go fully assembled and everything hooked up before any covering. It's saved me alot of work a few times! The other consideration to that is that you cover everything at once, so your cover job is not sitting a long time compared to the parts that go next to it....such as a fuselage that gets covered one year and wings that get covered a year later.... that keeps things matching up a little better usually. One thing I see so many do is cover to silver, or even worse, not that far...then hang it on a wall while they do the next parts. That really opens the door for contamination in the system! If you do need to get one part covered before you do another, at least take it through a white color coat, then you can scuff and re-shoot all the color at once.
JH

Obviously you then remove the wings and tailfeathers before covering the fuselage, but what do you remove internal to the fuse before covering? - Mike

[N96337]

Re: Pre-covering thinking...

I leave everything that I possibly can in there...like Hank said, it saves some serious contortions later! Just secure cables, etc with tape or safety wire, out of the way and where they wont get slop or overspray on them and go for it! Here's a pic of a Stinson, ready to cover, in the clean room..... You can see I left pretty much everything I could inside.






JH

[Robert Lees]

Re: Pre-covering thinking...

Don't forget the frame for the seat sling...a real PITA to put in afterwards.

Just imagine you are going to cover it, spray it, and go fly...that should make you install as much as feasible.

[Hank Jarrett]

Re: Pre-covering thinking...

The only things I removed from inside my 41 when I painted it were the things I was going to re-do on the inside (which was everything) seats, sling floorboards carpet door upholstery, headliner (didn't have the option of putting it in before cover since the 41 was just a repaint) glare shield, control wheels, instrument panel, kick plate, metal door trim, handles, sound suppression "stuff" and hat shelf. I also pulled the wheels and cowling to work separately.
About all I left in was the "glass" which I masked well but planned to replace all of anyway.
Taking it apart was a LOT more fun (and less work) than putting it back together!
Hank

Just a hint. Tie the control and trim cables to the tail and wing root with some safety wire. They are a pain to get back to the tail from the middle of the fuselage (see prior message on crawling in the tail). Another big hint is to be sure the access holes are in the right place to get the bolts through the control hook-ups and ESPECIALLY so you can get that vertical bolt in that holds the front of the tail wheel spring! If you don't you will need a friend with arms 5' long and about 3" in diameter.

[crispy critter]

Re: Pre-covering thinking...

Mike,
IMHO,just ask yourself, "what is it going to take to install this piece once the fabric is on?". Also remember how hard some items are to get to once the cover is on. However you mentioned something to me in an email earlier that you might want to think about.....most of these other guys have someone to help them move and turn thier parts as they cover them,or like me,I have a couple of fancy home stands so I can turn it by myself and I am still young enough to move it on my own even it if is loaded down with seat belt frame,fuel tank,H colum,yokes,panel,etc. if I decided to leave or install all this stuff before covering. If you are working solo then you might want to consider keeping it as light as possible.
Now,the things you really must have in before covering are the cable fairleads,control cables,pulleys,trim system(cable,crank,etc.),door frames,wood formers around the top of the cabin,stringers,and vertical stab. I would also recommend going ahead and installing the H colum and running/rigging the aileron cables that go inside the fuslage as well as the seatbelt frame like mention above by Rob. I'll try to get you some pics of the aileron system on Crispy tomorrow sometime so you can see what I done there. Also,you do have to have the wings,gear,and tail assembly off to cover the fuslage(except the vertical,it has to be installed). If you feel like you have left something out or are unsure of yourself when you get ready to cover don't be afraid or too bull headed to have someone who knows t-crafts to come look it over. I'm sure there is someone who is not too far from ya and if ya can't find someone give me a call. I can fly over there in a couple hours. Remember the covering is one step that should not and can not be rushed,it is fairly simple to do but does require some time and patients,but once you start it you want to continue going through at least the base color if possible. It is ok if you want to cover the fuslage then rebuild the rest of the airplane but just make sure you are ready to go from skin to color and if you need to stop somewhere along the way that is ok too,just make sure you put it in a place where it will stay clean,dry and out of direct sunlight for long periods of time. It will not hurt anything if you have to roll it out in the sun for an hour or so while you do something else and it won't hurt if it gets wet but that doesn't mean you want to leave it out in the hot sun all day then let it get rained on all night. Keep it in a clean dry place and out of reach of long periods of direct sunlight as much as possible until the UV protection is done. If there is a window in your garage then try to store the unprotected fabric away from the window and/or cover the window.....best way is to cover,silver/UV coating,and paint then you don't have to worry so much about it. Also,if you are going to cover part of it and then store it while working on something else.....!!!!!THIS IS VERY IMPORTANT!!!!! Make sure you critter proof it!!!! Keep it out of reach of cats,dogs,farm animals,mice,birds,moles,bee's,etc. Check and inspect the covered parts very often to ensure that critters have not found a new home in your fabric covered parts.

[crispy critter]

Re: Pre-covering thinking...

Mike,
I have those pics you wanted but I lost your email addy. email with your email and I'll send ya a poop-load of pics that shows the control cables and how they route.
I will also try to post them in my gallery forum later if I can remember my password and how to post pics there.....it's been a while.

[mhorowit]

Re: Pre-covering thinking...

Mike,
I have those pics you wanted but I lost your email addy. email with your email and I'll send ya a poop-load of pics that shows the control cables and how they route.
I will also try to post them in my gallery forum later if I can remember my password and how to post pics there.....it's been a while.

Wow! those pics are great! They will be a great help! Thanks for going to the effort!

I'm looking at the stringers and you seem to have way more standoffs then I recall. Was determining whether or not you needed them a matter of laying the stringer on the fuselage and then filling in the gap? Is that chaffing tape you are using to hold the standoffs in place? - Mike

[crispy critter]

Re: Pre-covering thinking...

No Mike,I used high quality 3m white electrical tape to hold the spacer blocks(standoffs) in place. I might not have need to use that many spacer blocks but I wanted to make sure the stringers stayed where I put them,the less they move,the less likely they will come loose or cause a problem later.

[Hank Jarrett]

Re: Pre-covering thinking...

OK, Mike is impressed by the pics. They MUST be good. How about sharing them someplace. If I remember right didn't you learn how to set up a photo site Mike? Either of you mind sharing? I would love to see them (yours or any others if anyone else has a good collection. Nekid "T" photos is almost better than nekid wemon).
Hank

[mhorowit]

Re: Pre-covering thinking...

OK, Mike is impressed by the pics. They MUST be good. How about sharing them someplace. If I remember right didn't you learn how to set up a photo site Mike? Either of you mind sharing? I would love to see them (yours or any others if anyone else has a good collection. Nekid "T" photos is almost better than nekid wemon).
Hank

Poor Hank; and I thought I was "over the top" - Mike