Considering Purchase Of A project 41 modified to F 19

[Jim Herpst]

Re: Considering Purchase Of A project 41 modified to F 19

The latches on the wood Deluxe doors are similar to automotive type with a bolt engaging a strike plate on the wood door frame. I think the outer handles were Ford Model A units, it may be the whole assembly was off the shelf from Ford or another maker. Only the Deluxe had elevator trim, the non-Deluxe '41s kept the flipper trim. I believe two wing tanks was standard on the Deluxes. If its registered/data plated as a BC12-65, its a Deluxe, but may in reality be a mix of lots of parts of who knows what.

It is registered as a BC12-65

[NC36061]

Re: Considering Purchase Of A project 41 modified to F 19

All of the Deluxe that I have seen used a Dexter screen door latch, including inside and outside handles.

That could be, I just figured if the handles were automotive type, the whole unit was from a car maker. Screen doors would have been cheaper no doubt.

[Jim Herpst]

Re: Considering Purchase Of A project 41 modified to F 19

That could be, I just figured if the handles were automotive type, the whole unit was from a car maker. Screen doors would have been cheaper no doubt.

Lighter also. This is a riot when one thinks about all the nonsense a mfg goes through with parts today being PMA d... Guess I need to find some PMA d aluminum screen door latches of this

[Hank Jarrett]

Re: Considering Purchase Of A project 41 modified to F 19

Hank, you can do a major alteration to the STC by not doing some of the provisions...like gross weight, short mount, etc.

How do you log compliance with the STC then? The only STC I have experience with was one for covering and they were VERY EXPLICIT that you MUST do the cover in strict accordance with the instructions and with no changes to the materials or procedures. I went back with dope instead.

Hank

Not doubting your word, I just have little experience with doing STCs. I tend to like doing things back to original (hence the Dope)

[Hank Jarrett]

Re: Considering Purchase Of A project 41 modified to F 19

Hank, It has the Shock Mount Panel. The Trim is a question I will need to get answered.

On the one hand it SHOULD be a Deluxe with the wooden doors...(by the way what is the latching mechanism like?) I know on the tube and Fabric door units it is a simple tab that folds down against the tubing to close the door in place. I thought all 41 s had the built in Trim.

It IS a Deluxe if it has the wood doors (when you start on them let me know and I will send you some simple mods that won't show and really make the door more solid) and shock mount panel (get with me when you start working on rebuilding the panel. It is a pain, but not impossible and worth the trouble). The tube and fabric door does have a lever that rotates into a tab to close. Simple, but looks really cheap (Taylor would say "inexpensive", I say cheap. It is used on my 45 Deluxe). The 41 Deluxe used a wood screen door latch that was still in production a decade ago and can often be found in the drawers of an old timer lock smith or hardware store. I found several when I was doing mine and gave all but two to other 41 owners. Check the old timers, not the young guys working from a truck and I will see if any of my locksmith buddies still have any. All 41 Deluxe planes had a tab on the elevator, not a flipper.


My bet is the later wings are not in the logs as they were added while it was still in its current project stage.

NOTHING wrong with the stamped rib wings! They are aerodynamically the same, a little lighter (although that could be the finish when measured) and much less prone to damage. Teh ONLY reason I can see to put the stick rib wings on is originality. The one thing the pre-war wings were better on was the hinge fittings. As an engineer I HATE the cast hinge fittings and would not fly with them. I always look at castings as a mass of cracks flying in close formation. My opinion of them is, however, not supported by significant evidence. (but I still hate them).


Sounds like it will be better to take it back to a bare bones 65 HP Ship.

That would be my recommendation (but I really like "original", especially on a fairly rare type. You can get 100mph fairly easy with a clean, light bird and good prop, although I think a good climb prop is better (more fun). Why be in a hurry in a Taylorcraft? Want to go fast, build an RV.


I discovered also he has only one wing tank installed. I realize a second could be added.... or is allowed to have the second wing tank on a 41?

Second tank is allowed, but not standard. If you are even a little on the "hefty" side you won't be able to use it much.



Hank Living in South Carolina it is NO FUN to have the sun beating on you most anytime of the year....

TRUE THAT!!!! Even here in SE Virginia the summer sun is BRUTAL!

[Hank Jarrett]

Re: Considering Purchase Of A project 41 modified to F 19

OK, I tried to embed the answer in with the questions and it put the answers into the quote. Sorry.

This is photos of the original 41 Deluxe door handles. First three photos are different views of inner and outer handles. The last picture is an original handle on top and a copy I tried to hand make (hand pressed from aluminum). I was not satisfied with the quality of mine so I am still looking for an original if anyone has one. It was a little brute to press out! Never again! They must have used a 10 Ton press!

Hank

Yea, I spend (waste) a LOT of time making silly small parts that aren't needed to get in the air.

[3Dreaming]

Re: Considering Purchase Of A project 41 modified to F 19

How do you log compliance with the STC then? The only STC I have experience with was one for covering and they were VERY EXPLICIT that you MUST do the cover in strict accordance with the instructions and with no changes to the materials or procedures. I went back with dope instead.

Hank

Not doubting your word, I just have little experience with doing STCs. I tend to like doing things back to original (hence the Dope)

I know with the old Swick STC they said you could do any part or all. In some cases you can say you installed STC so and so except for the part you didn't install.

[Hank Jarrett]

Re: Considering Purchase Of A project 41 modified to F 19

That actually makes sense. You sure the FAA said that? ;-) I WOULD think you would have to specify what parts you did and didn't do in the logs.

Hank

Wow! The FAA used common sense, HAD to be the Small Aircraft Directorate in Kansas City. Those guys were great to work with!

[N96337]

Re: Considering Purchase Of A project 41 modified to F 19

You get with the FAA and do a deviation on the STC. It's not a biggie, and is noted in your log entry (Installed STC such and such with the deviation of blah blah, approved by FAA form 337, dated 00-00-00.) and on the 337 much like a field approval. I've got a couple on the PA12 I'm working on now.
John

[Jim Herpst]

Re: Considering Purchase Of A project 41 modified to F 19

Hank, you can do a major alteration to the STC by not doing some of the provisions...like gross weight, short mount, etc.

I believe you mentioned yours has the extended baggage.. does it also have the short mount? If so how di it become to be approved...part of the Gilbertti STC only. I have read on here about aft CG with the short mount.... Thanks !

[Jim Herpst]

Re: Considering Purchase Of A project 41 modified to F 19

OK, I tried to embed the answer in with the questions and it put the answers into the quote. Sorry.

This is photos of the original 41 Deluxe door handles. First three photos are different views of inner and outer handles. The last picture is an original handle on top and a copy I tried to hand make (hand pressed from aluminum). I was not satisfied with the quality of mine so I am still looking for an original if anyone has one. It was a little brute to press out! Never again! They must have used a 10 Ton press!

Hank

Yea, I spend (waste) a LOT of time making silly small parts that aren't needed to get in the air.

Thank You Hank! great answers! The plne will require a bit of work to get it back to stock (getting rid of some junk added to make it a seaplane and also the model 19 mods. I hope the seat parts are there (support for canvas) need to get some more pictures for sure. . Thank You again

[PA1195]

Re: Considering Purchase Of A project 41 modified to F 19

Short mount extended baggage pre-wars are among us. I've seen one but not mine. Configured for wheels, skis, and floats with a C85-12. If becomes an issue I can forward an N*****.

Gary

[Jim Herpst]

Re: Considering Purchase Of A project 41 modified to F 19

Short mount extended baggage pre-wars are among us. I've seen one but not mine. Configured for wheels, skis, and floats with a C85-12. If becomes an issue I can forward an N*****.

Gary

Thank you Gary. I am debating just taking it back to a small baggage behind the seat as part of the sling. No door or other BS on top of it. Idea will be to do what I can to keep it light if that is the way I go.

[PA1195]

Re: Considering Purchase Of A project 41 modified to F 19

If the current baggage is lined with wood or metal it will weigh more than nothing back there or the factory's original design. It can be retained but lined with fabric with light floor if you ever plan on carrying anything of size. Simply placard the rear loading datum on the floor for your most rearward configuration (like 3 gal fuel main, your weight, full wing tank and aft baggage to remain within aft CG). Make a light removable mesh bulkhead or holding bag if the baggage isn't tied down. Or as you suggest restore it to original config. I like a tinted skylight over my head in turns and for more head room, and light in winter.

Mine's atypical and mission built for Alaska on wheels, skis, and floats. A standard T wouldn't serve my needs. But I were just going flying small tires on calm sunny days a stock C-85 short mount would suffice. But then I'd own something else for that anyway.

Gary

[Hank Jarrett]

Re: Considering Purchase Of A project 41 modified to F 19

Thank You Hank! great answers! The plne will require a bit of work to get it back to stock (getting rid of some junk added to make it a seaplane and also the model 19 mods. I hope the seat parts are there (support for canvas) need to get some more pictures for sure. . Thank You again

Mine had LOTS of junk that had to be removed, not least of which was about 20# of wires that weren't even hooked to anything! The W&B was TOTALLY bogus, which I caught when I was looking at the Type Cert and was AMAZED that my particular plane had EXACTLY the same weight and CG as the Type Cert showed. It hadn't been weighed in decades from what I could tell. Someone just copied the info from the Type Cert. The actual CG was right at the aft limit (which explained why the controls were so delightfully light and spirited). I was on the verge of an uncontrollable stall almost all the time. It was VERY lucky I never tried a spin in her. When I pulled all the junk out I really should have taken a photo of the pile on the hangar floor.

If you need info on the seats I have photos and patterns. The wire bracing for the seats is a real nightmare to put together if you take it apart. It only goes together ONE WAY! Take lots of photos and mark the ends of each wire so you can re-assemble it right. I also have an upholsterer who made my seats and was great about finding seat materials that matched the original (looks like Taylorcraft got a LOT of interior fabrics and materials from a Studebaker plant near the old Taylorcraft plant. This upholsterer does Studebaker restoration work). I made my seat sling from Tent Canvas using a pattern that was pretty rotten. The lacing pattern is also kind of confusing, but photos can walk you through it.