Engine Upgrade Cost

[labe0202]

Hello,

Currently own a 46 BC-12D with an A65. The home strip is 1600' long with tall trees on either end which surprise me sometimes. I recently started wondering if the extra horsepower from a C85 with the Harer STC would make me feel better for takeoffs and the possibility of a go-around. Before I got too deep down this road I figured I'd see if it was even a realistic possibility financially (read "convince wife"). I've seen some used, mid-time, engines listed for $6000-$8000. I'm not an A+P though so I have no idea of what the labor would cost along with a new prop and the possibility of electrical system components or a starter. I've got Eisemann mags and it sounds like they're pretty tight with a short mount so the long mount may be necessary too. No need to keep it light sport other than the resale value so the long mount with 1500 lbs. option may work too.

Not very specific here but thought someone may have some good input before I start to go further down this road. I'd really like a starter too and understand that that will add some weight and make the short mount a tougher option too.

Thanks in advance,
Ben

[Robert Lees]

Re: Engine Upgrade Cost

Hello Ben, and welcome.

Terry Bowden of this parish has the STC (which you know) and a few companies do the Engine mods to go from 85 to 100hp.

Having done both, I'd recommend the mods wholeheartedly. Yes, you need a new prop, but some A65 props are worth more than those for a C85.

Regarding Eisemann mags: They are not tight on the short mount. They will be on a short mount with the deeper accessory case (in fact, they won't fit). Nor will any other mags.

If you go for the deeper accessory case (with starter, etc and the 4" longer mount) then the mags rotate the other way. So you will need to either modify your mags (I can't quite recall how..perhaps new impulse units + changing the breaker cam orientation). Whichever, DO NOT THROW AWAY your Eisemann's or swap them.

Hope that helps,

Rob

[labe0202]

Re: Engine Upgrade Cost

Hello Ben, and welcome.

Terry Bowden of this parish has the STC (which you know) and a few companies do the Engine mods to go from 85 to 100hp.

Having done both, I'd recommend the mods wholeheartedly. Yes, you need a new prop, but some A65 props are worth more than those for a C85.

Regarding Eisemann mags: They are not tight on the short mount. They will be on a short mount with the deeper accessory case (in fact, they won't fit). Nor will any other mags.

If you go for the deeper accessory case (with starter, etc and the 4" longer mount) then the mags rotate the other way. So you will need to either modify your mags (I can't quite recall how..perhaps new impulse units + changing the breaker cam orientation). Whichever, DO NOT THROW AWAY your Eisemann's or swap them.

Hope that helps,

Rob

Thanks for the welcome and the quick reply! This is great insight and it's nice to hear a vote of confidence for the upgrade. I know it's impossible to get the price of the new engine back if I ever decided to sell the plane, but it's been in the family for 30 years so I don't see that happening any time soon. The plane sits more than it should because I'm leery of the takeoffs and landings. Long runways have made me soft, I guess. I've rented hangar space at nearby airports in years past but it's hard to justify the cost when I can hangar it rent-free at the farm. Plus, there's just something fun about taking off on the strip in the middle of the field. I usually try to call the police dispatcher ahead of time in case a car driving by reports "a plane going down." My landings aren't that bad.

I'd love the starter but I've heard some negative reviews on the flight handling with the long mount installed. It sounds like it's impossible to install a -12 engine without the long mount so that may just not be an option. I can't imagine lengthening the cowling is an easy task either. Really don't have a need for an electrical system otherwise. I'd guess that this option adds a considerable amount of cash too. Handheld and battery-operated intercom work great with the shielded ignition.

Anyone have a ballpark estimate of what this would cost? And thanks again, Rob!

[woodmw]

Re: Engine Upgrade Cost

Ben,

You should get with Chuck Avon. (cvavon) He did the upgrade to his '40 model. Here's the thread:

http://vb.taylorcraft.org/showthread.php?9154-C85-Engine-up-grade-on-n26658

[woodmw]

Re: Engine Upgrade Cost

Ben,

You should get with Chuck Avon. (cvavon) He did the upgrade to his '40 model. Here's the thread:

http://vb.taylorcraft.org/showthread.php?9154-C85-Engine-up-grade-on-n26658

[N96337]

Re: Engine Upgrade Cost

It sounds like it's impossible to install a -12 engine without the long mount so that may just not be an option.

It is???? Should've told the people that did mine years ago! I've had the -12 and a short mount since the 60's. It can be done, and it's not that tight. Mine even had a Delco generator...but it required a dimple in the firewall. Short mount 85's are the hotrods. You'll love it!
John

[senior]

Re: Engine Upgrade Cost

You may not have to change props too.
Depends on what you got now.
My 65-75 had a 72-45 which I repitched to 72-42 for the 65hp.
Now on the 85-8, it works quite well, 2500rpm on climb-out.
It preforms very well, much like a climb prop.

[astjp2]

Re: Engine Upgrade Cost

I have a 74" prop so I can climb better, McCauley is the only approved one for an O-200. If you are going to do the swap, spend the money on an O-200 and not waste your money on the 85. It moves the engine forward 5/8" with the lord mounts. Starter and generator are optional. Fuel system requirements are the same between both engines and the extra power is nice. A taylorcraft can take off in 250' or so with the o-200. Tim

[labe0202]

Re: Engine Upgrade Cost

I'd be very happy if I could do a short mount with a starter. Sounds like I just have to pick the right accessories to make it work? The prop will have to be replaced as my wooden Sensenich is getting tired an I will be replacing either way. Will definitely go for a climb prop of some sort, I'm okay with giving up some cruise speed. Don't know if I could swing the O-200. It's quite a bit more than a C-85 would run for, isn't it? I'm willing to invest some cash to be comfortable flying more but can only go so far...

[labe0202]

Re: Engine Upgrade Cost

Ben,

You should get with Chuck Avon. (cvavon) He did the upgrade to his '40 model. Here's the thread:
http://vb.taylorcraft.org/showthread...rade-on-n26658

Read through quite a few threads on this but for some reason never stumbled on this one. Excellent information and great idea of what goes into the modification. Thanks for the link and I'll be sure to get a hold of Chuck.

[cvavon]

Re: Engine Upgrade Cost

The dash 12 engine will fit on the short mount with a B&C starter and i talked to Sky Teck at Sun and Fun and they have changed there starters and i think they will fit also the B&C alternator is nice also but you need to get Terry Bowdens paper work for the luscombe exhaust to make room on the back of the engine.SO NICE TO SAY CLEAR PROP AND PUSH A BUTTON AND HEAR AIRPLANE NOISE!!!!!!

[cvavon]

Re: Engine Upgrade Cost

Ok here we go as far as what it cost me luscombe exhaust $1100.00 air form baffles$671.00 Reversing right angle tack drive$98.75 carberator parts $214.79 electrical parts from B&C to include starter and battery$1221.00 B&C alternator with continental drive gear off Ebay $600.00 Oil filter adapter from ebay$145.00 then there was about $500.00 to $600.00 small things.I am sure i have missed something then add the cost of a engine and you aer right at $20000.00

[labe0202]

Re: Engine Upgrade Cost

Ok here we go as far as what it cost me luscombe exhaust $1100.00 air form baffles$671.00 Reversing right angle tack drive$98.75 carberator parts $214.79 electrical parts from B&C to include starter and battery$1221.00 B&C alternator with continental drive gear off Ebay $600.00 Oil filter adapter from ebay$145.00 then there was about $500.00 to $600.00 small things.I am sure i have missed something then add the cost of a engine and you aer right at $20000.00

Huge help, thanks for adding all that up. I'm assuming there's no labor included in this?

[M Towsley]

Re: Engine Upgrade Cost

Or Chuck, you could have bought a Cessna and turned a key to start it. Lol!

[PA1195]

Re: Engine Upgrade Cost

Airplane Philosophy 101: Generally it's cheaper to buy it than build it. That's unless you have the training, time, and tools to do the job (and want to experience the process). Note the time factor...that means not flying unless you have access to another plane.

I've done both. Taken airplanes from an existing cover and airframe condition and assisted/paid someone to do a complete airframe rebuild. Same for a few engines. In the end the experience was interesting but there was no savings in cost, and the down time was tough to endure. I could have bought an upgraded aircraft and flown for less grief and expense.

Unless you're young and have a potentially long life ahead then time isn't as critical as if you're older and already riding the wave to shore when it comes to flying.

Gary