Portable transponder

[astjp2]

Well I now have a portable transponder, this will get me across the border with Canada on my way home with her from Alaska....its been 5 years to put this box together with a lot of procrastination in between...Tim

[Stumpy]

Re: Portable transponder

Tim,

What kind of set-up did you rig? My brother and I have been mulling over putting something together that could be moved from one rig to another when we venture forth into places we'd rather not be.

Oh yeah...what way are you returning outside? If you're heading this way (down through Washington) let me know. Welcome to layover here, or if you develop any buggers I have bits and pieces and a decent stock of hardware at W16 (my temporary home). Or if you're heading south east of the Cascades I'm back home off and on and it'd be a grand excuse to pop over for a cuppa joe...

[DanBrown]

Re: Portable transponder

I put a Microair transponder and an encoder with a closed cell 7ah battery in an aluminum box strapped in front of the seat. I added a bracket for an ICON portable radio. The wires for the exterior antennas for both are underneath and come up to be attached. I put 2 cigarette lighter sockets in the side of the box to power external stuff (like a gps and ipad). I can take the box out to re-charge (get about 7 hours of time on the batteries reliably) or recharge it in place in the hanger. I found that the electronic shop in Lancaster, PA had no problem with signing off on the bi-annual requirement -- been doing that for 6 years now with no problems.
See the old thread http://vb.taylorcraft.org/showthread...-T-Craft/page2 for more about it.

What I haven't seen yet is a way to meet the ADS-B output requirement that is facing us in 2020. While there are now mode S transponders that can be portable, the bug is the requirement for a TSO'd GPS output squitter. Any ideas?

[M Towsley]

Re: Portable transponder

If you have a non-electric aircraft you are not required to have ADS-B. You would utilize a waiver similar to what I have in Class C airspace for not having a transponder.

8. How will the new ADS-B Out rule effect me?
On January 1, 2020, when operating in the airspace designated in 14 CFR § 91.225 (outlined below) you must be equipped with ADS-B Out avionics that meet the performance requirements of 14 CFR §91.227. Aircraft not complying with the requirements may be denied access to this airspace.

Under the rule, ADS-B Out performance will be required to operate in:
1.Class A, B, and C.
2.Class E airspace within the 48 contiguous states and the District of Columbia at and above 10,000 feet MSL, excluding the airspace at and below 2,500 feet above the surface.
3.Class E airspace at and above 3,000 feet MSL over the Gulf of Mexico from the coastline of the United States out to 12 nautical miles.
4.Around those airports identified in 14 CFR part 91, Appendix D.


The ADS-B Out rule does not apply in the airspace defined in items 1 and 2 above for any aircraft that was not originally certificated with an electrical system or that has not subsequently been certified with such a system installed, including balloons and gliders.
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[DanBrown]

Re: Portable transponder

Marty,

While I don't have a regulatory requirement for a transponder for a lot of the flying I do, I can't always avoid class B and C airspace around here. Also, I'm finding that being able to see traffic on the i-Pad is often a real help in spotting other ships I missed in my visual scan. Unfortunately, I only see ADS-B traffic when there is another ship close by with ADS-B out -- that's a real hole in the FAA implementation of the next generation system.

The other week, I was flying Young Eagles as part of an EAA event at Bay Bridge (W29) and seeing lots of traffic on the i-Pad -- a real help in spotting aircraft in all the clutter and sequencing my traffic pattern entry with 10 others flying the same pattern at an uncontrolled field.

So, IMHO, a transponder and ADS-B are safety improvements that are highly desirable in high density airspace.

Dan

[M Towsley]

Re: Portable transponder

I completely understand, Dan, given the airspace where you fly. It is too bad that simple, fun flying has to utilize electronics.

However, I think it is another crutch for some folks who like to keep their eyes in the cockpit and not outside. And, the problem of non-transponder, non ADS-B aircraft are still out there lurking around...like me. My PCAS on the dash isn't a cure-all but it keeps my eyes pointed out the windshield.

Several friends of mine who fly King-Airs and Citations have their head in the cockpit almost the whole flight. When they fly their other, less complex aircraft, I find them relying on ATC more than just looking around.

[astjp2]

Re: Portable transponder

When the ADS-b is fully implemented, there will be no exceptions because there will be portables that run on battery like a handheld...its not here yet but it will happen. tim

[M Towsley]

Re: Portable transponder

Hi Tim,

Where did you obtain this information from, as the Feds I have spoken with really don't have a clue. Just curious, thanks!

[Hank Jarrett]

Re: Portable transponder

Sounds like something the FAA Tech Center researchers would say without talking to the field activities who have to put it in place or the Headquarters folks who ill write the regs. Not that I disagree with it, I think it WILL come, but I am not worrying about it. It will take longer to put in place with more delays than the 406 MHz (satellite) ELTs.

Hank

NOTHING goes through the FAA admin maze THAT fast.

[astjp2]

Re: Portable transponder

I was at the university of Alaska when they were developing the technology, there are several iterations of what will happen and the public will balk but with drones being in the airspace, it will happen for seperation. "in the name of Safety"

[Hank Jarrett]

Re: Portable transponder

Were you working Capstone and ADSB? I was the AGATE Manager at NASA for that! What a great test area to work on the new technologies. I wish I could have gotten away from my desk to actually do some of the field work with Capstone.

I agree it IS coming, and we WILL like it, but I can't imagine the FAA getting their stuff all in one bag for it to happen very soon. Administrative processes take MUCH longer than technology processes! If they do it RIGHT, they will be making cost the major driver now. We can't afford ADSB systems that cost more than a lot of us paid for our planes and a system that uses too much power will be useless. There is a real opportunity for cooperative advancement with the manufacturers if the FAA will listen to them instead of just regulating. The companies can build inexpensive, light, low power usage systems based on the AGATE architecture that could get the systems in planes DECADES sooner at very low cost. We had a Squider concept that transmitted a non-electrical GA planes position but would NOT provide collision avoidance info to the nen-electric plane that was dirt cheap. The airliner or drone would see you as a "blind" plane and it's program would know to avoid YOU and you wouldn't be using the collision avoidance protocols. We were on our own to avoid each other, but the fully equipped planes would not be running into the light planes or each other. The side advantage was that the system replaced ALL ELTs and provided much better locations of impact, even if the transmitter was destroyed or sank in water in the crash.

The real selling point of the Squider was that it could be built for less than the cost of a 406 Mhz ELT and provided both functions. With just a bit of funding Garmin could have built a prototype for testing. Blind Squiders would have been MUCH better than the new ELTs and provided collision separation with the fully equipped planes.

Hank

[astjp2]

Re: Portable transponder

Hank, I was just an observer with Capstone, never participated but I was always asking questions and learning about the system. I do like the idea that you can integrate a Garmin 396 to have ADS-B in. Neat feature but since the 396 is obsolete and still way expensive for a used one. Tim

[Hank Jarrett]

Re: Portable transponder

The Squider is the key. All it does is constantly send out it's position and ID. The satellites pick that up and store the info (last position sent and identifier) and that functions as an ELT. Other planes that are fully equipped see you as a "not participating target". They see you electronically, but you don't receive, so you have to rely on Mark-1 eyeball. Right of way "don't count" with non-participants...you avoid them. Of course they will almost always be below 5,000' and flying slow, so they really won't be a problem to the heavy and fast fully "equipped" guys.
The real beauty was the business model. The squider was small, cheap and low power, but it had a GPS inside and for just a little more we had a display of Lat-Long that could display on the panel. Use that with a sectional and you had your continuous position. Not many people would want that unless as a back up position, but for just a little more you could link it to a tablet computer or a Palm Pilot (remember those?) with a moving map. The equivalent to the hand held GPS you can buy at COSTCO now, but this was a LONG time ago! The next upgrade was a panel GPS nav system (that is available now, just not with ADSB) and one more step up was the full ADSB system.
When we did the market studies we found that almost NO ONE wanted the basic squider so we could afford to sell it at a loss so EVERYONE including little ultra lights could have them. The key was to keep the upgrades to small increments, kind of like a "bate-n-switch" but totally in the open. Almost everyone wanted to upgrade to at least the Tablet compatible version where the manufacturer could make a profit.
If we could have gotten through the management inertia we could have had cockpit systems 10 years further advanced than what we have now. NASA never seemed to understand that perfection is the enemy of good enough and just because you HAVE a technology that is better, you don't HAVE to use it! Especially when that "BEST" system costs the national debt!

Hank

[LostnSpace]

Re: Portable transponder

A guy at work said, just before you take off, call a friend and tell them you are a patriot, you love the constitution above all documents and you will fight for this country on this soil. Now the NAS is tracking you and can tell where you end up, Tom

[RyanShort1]

Re: Portable transponder

I'm thinking seriously about this - once I can afford it...

http://adsb.skyguardtwx.com/uat-transceivers/