No data plate or logs

[vic]

From what I've read if I use an engine with no logs or plate I can maintain it with new log book stating

A new logbook can be generated to log maintenance and condition from this point on.The initial entry would read something like this: "Previous logbooks lost, hours unknown."followed by a summary of the work you have detailed below.Any attempt to make an estimate of previous hours on the engine will carry no weight as you cannot verify the hours and when the engine was overhauled.In essence, you will record the current condition of the engine with no reference to the past, and continue to operate the engine on a conditional basis until inspections or operational experience indicate that an overhaul is required.Once the engine is overhauled, the clock can be re-set and a more traditional set of logs can be generated using the date of the overhaul as a documented starting point.

Is this the case?

[Guest]

Re: No data plate or logs

I believe that may be true for lost logs but not for lost plate. Lost plate means you don't actually have an engine. Of course if you had the logs perhaps you could replace the plate if lost but you are describing having neither.

Dave R

[Hank Jarrett]

Re: No data plate or logs

Anyone have a junk engine with a data plate? Just rebuild THAT engine using all replacement parts EXCEPT the data plate.

I can hear the FAA guys spinning from here!

Hank

[vic]

Re: No data plate or logs

LOL wouldn't be the first time someone lost logs after 10 years and his data plate wass too damaged or worn to read. There are plates on bad cases.
Where else is the serial #?

[Hank Jarrett]

Re: No data plate or logs

When I bought my first Taylorcraft it came with a spare engine (A-65) in a crate with a fresh overhaul and great logs. When I went to use it it was absolutely BEAUTIFUL! Looked like it had just come off the factory floor, until we tried to start it. To say things weren't quite right would be a massive understatement.

First we did a bore scope through the plug holes, followed by pulling the valve covers when we could see filthy valves and un-ground valve seats....THAT WE COULD SEE WITH A BORE SCOPE! We pulled the cylinders and it became obvious that the engine had what we called an "Aerosol Overhaul". It had been fully disassembled, cleaned, new valve seats put in....and then all the parts had been painted "real purdy" and it was put back together. It was a beautiful mess of worn out parts. I contacted the FISDO in Richmond with the information in the logs and they said the signature was bogus, the IA number was for a guy in Texas and all the paperwork was forged. The engine was a really nice paperweight. None of the people in the logs even existed, but at least the case PN and SN were for real. Everything was rebuild-able, but evidently the owner got it all apart and decided he was in over his head so he faked the paperwork, painted the parts and just bolted it back together. Put it in a really nice crate and sold it at an airshow.

Buyer beware! And yes, I did end up rebuilding it, which is a whole different story.

Hank

[Guest]

Re: No data plate or logs

LOL wouldn't be the first time someone lost logs after 10 years and his data plate wass too damaged or worn to read. There are plates on bad cases.
Where else is the serial #?

on the data plate, I am not aware of any other location, legally you need the data plate

read thru part 45 subpart b

[N96337]

Re: No data plate or logs

Not a big deal. Continental SIL00-9A gives full instructions on where to send your money....

TELEDYNE CONTINENTAL ® AIRCRAFT ENGINE
SERVICE INFORMATION LETTER
Contains useful information pertaining to your aircraft engine
SUBJECT: ENGINE DATA PLATES
PURPOSE: To provide procedures for acquiring replacement engine data plates.
COMPLIANCE: Whenever an engine data plate must be replaced due to being damaged, lost or
stolen.
MODELS
AFFECTED: All TCM engine models, including engines manufactured under license by Rolls
Royce.
REASON FOR REVISION: Price Change
Replacement engine data plates may be obtained from Teledyne Continental Motors by following the
procedure provide below.
1. Request for replacement data plates must be made in writing.
2. Contact your local FAA office and obtain written approval from them as specified in 14
CFR 45.13 paragraph (b) and (d).
3. If the engine data plate has been lost or stolen, or if the removed data plate is being
retained by the FAA, you must obtain written certification from the FAA on official FAA
letterhead verifying the engine model and serial number for which the data plate is being
requested.
4. The old, removed data plate, unless it is being retained by the FAA as noted in step 3
above, must be returned to TCM with your written request for a replacement data plate
and the above documentation.
5. Enclose a check or money order made payable to Teledyne Continental Motors, in US
funds, in the amount of $100.00.
Send request to:
Teledyne Continental Motors
P.O. Box 90
Mobile, Al 36601
ATTN: CUSTOMER SERVICE DEPARTMENT

It's mostly painless, and Continental is actually cheaper by $25.00 than Lycoming. (I'm going through this exact thing on a Lycoming O-320 right now). Until you have a data plate on the engine, you have an unairworthy engine.
As far as the logs, that's not a huge deal either, except that any AD that has been due in the past, is now due immediately, since you can't tell how many hours are on the engine. As long as it's not being used for hire, there is no requirement for TBO, so as you said, run it on condition.
John

[astjp2]

Re: No data plate or logs

I like the idea of buying a blank on ebay and stamping my own.....