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Engine failure in flight in a Cessna 150

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  • Adamo13
    started a topic Engine failure in flight in a Cessna 150

    Engine failure in flight in a Cessna 150

    Hey all,
    Had a bit of excitement the other day and was hoping to see what you guys think. (Please forgive the book it took to tell the story!) I recently acquired a 1959 Cessna C-150 with a 0-200 to fly while my Taylorcraft is currently sitting sad, wing-less, and waiting for recover. The 150 was local and had been sitting for roughly two years in an open faced hangar prior to the day I picked her up. The plane had a pre-buy inspection and turned up nothing. It was then flown 10 minutes from a private strip to the airport where the annual was to be done. The flight was uneventful. The annual likewise turned up nothing of major concern. She then sat outside for about two weeks through two major rain storms before I was able to pick her up. The plane was fueled with 100LL prior to my arrival and due to pilot error I forgot to sump the tanks. The flight home was around 1 hour and 20 mins with 4 touch an go landings at an airport along the way. There was absolutely nothing abnormal about this flight and I arrived home without incident. The plane then sat in my heated shop for around a month or so with tanks a little over half full. I scheduled a BFR to maintain currency and the night before the flight I topped off the tanks with 87 octane ethanol free car gas and stored the plane back in the shop overnight. The next morning myself and a CFI departed from my private strip and again due to over sight the tanks went unsumped. We did 8 landings both full stop and touch and go at a near by airport and had been using the carb heat outside of the green arc. On the way back to my home we did a steep turn and a power on stall. At this time I pulled power out to perform a power off stall and carb heat was NOT applied. Within a second or two and with no observed sputtering the engine failed completely. The prop was also not windmilling. All attempts at restart failed. Luckily we were near my home out in flat farm country and we made a successful forced landing in one of my cut soybean fields about a half mile from my shop. After being on the ground about 5 minutes I gave her two shots of primer and a little throttle and she started and ran as if nothing had happened. Realizing my mistake I immediately sumped the tanks. I found no water but some small rust debris. There was great flow from the gascolator and nothing found in the screens. Upon further examination I found that the Silicon around the filler necks of the wing tanks was very shoddy and quite possibly could have let rain water enter the tanks, not to mention the possibility of condensation forming on the inside of the tank from sitting half full for a month. I also noticed a large build up of surface rust on the filler necks but the inside of the tanks show no signs of corrosion only very minor staining in small areas. Again I apologize for such a long post and for those of you still with me is it plausible that either water in the fuel or carb icing caused the engine to fail? Wouldn't it have to be a large shot of water to shut down an engine that fast? It just seems strange to me that there was no stammering or surging in RPM's but rather instant shut off. That day was a fairly high risk day for carburetor icing. Could carb icing form fast enough and great enough to shut down an engine after only a few seconds of idle power and no carb heat applied? Any information at all on this is would be greatly appreciated. I love flying and I love learning and I'm hoping to be able to keep doing both! Thanks to all in advance!

    Adam McPeck
    1950 Taylorcraft BC12-D N6627N
    1959 Cessna 150 N7950E
    Last edited by Adamo13; 11-13-2014, 01:33.

  • magman
    replied
    Re: Engine failure in flight in a Cessna 150

    Originally posted by Mark Julicher View Post
    That is just preposterous! We thought you designed the Taube!
    Mark

    Had to find a new career after the Nina & Pinta Projects.

    Leave a comment:


  • Mark Julicher
    replied
    Re: Engine failure in flight in a Cessna 150

    Originally posted by magman View Post

    Wanted to clarify that as many people think it was a Bleriot!
    That is just preposterous! We thought you designed the Taube!

    Leave a comment:


  • magman
    replied
    Re: Engine failure in flight in a Cessna 150

    I do go on several forums.

    Haven't found a 150 Forum yet.

    There is a group but I find that unwieldy.

    Leave a comment:


  • Adamo13
    replied
    Re: Engine failure in flight in a Cessna 150

    Completely agree with Hank and Dave. I will try to get this posted on a Cessna forum too. I'm very appreciative of all the help I've received here so far! Bought the 'nose-dragger' ironically to keep me in the air while I restore the Taylorcraft and for training purposes for my younger cousin learning to fly. Unsettling to not know 100% why an engine failed!

    Leave a comment:


  • Hank Jarrett
    replied
    Re: Engine failure in flight in a Cessna 150

    ABSOLUTELY!!! Some of us tease about "Nose Draggers" but most of us also have flown them...or at least have friends who do. Great info that is ALWAYS welcome here.

    Hank

    Leave a comment:


  • 3Dreaming
    replied
    Re: Engine failure in flight in a Cessna 150

    Originally posted by Robert Lees View Post
    This IS in the "Hangar Mates" section, so it's perfectly alright. And there's nothing wrong with the C150 either...it does exactly what it was designed for!
    I don't think anyone is taking issue with it being here, but rather that it should be shared on a Cessna 150 forum too.

    Leave a comment:


  • magman
    replied
    Re: Engine failure in flight in a Cessna 150

    My thought is that ALL of us that have some knowledge that may reduce the chances of danger or injury to another have a RESPONSIBILITY to share that

    knowledge with other folks.

    If you have been in Aviation any length of time I'm sure you can share stories of needless tragedy.

    I do participate in other forums.

    Sometimes I learn; other times others do.

    That is the great thing about forums & Aviation people.

    fyi- The first aircraft I worked on when I received my A & P was a Taylorcraft.

    Wanted to clarify that as many people think it was a Bleriot!

    Leave a comment:


  • Robert Lees
    replied
    Re: Engine failure in flight in a Cessna 150

    This IS in the "Hangar Mates" section, so it's perfectly alright. And there's nothing wrong with the C150 either...it does exactly what it was designed for!

    Leave a comment:


  • Hank Jarrett
    replied
    Re: Engine failure in flight in a Cessna 150

    Yea, the thread may not have been on Taylorcrafts, but I sure saw a lot of interesting things in it. Don't stop with the cross talk, but who knows how to get it to the 150 guys?

    Hank

    Leave a comment:


  • drude
    replied
    Re: Engine failure in flight in a Cessna 150

    Hi all,

    I am not being a smart Alec (not sure why Alec got saddled with that term) nor am I chasing you away.

    This thread was interesting and I would think that there is a Cessna 150 forum somewhere that needs to see this stuff.

    Adamo13 you should check that out.

    Dave

    Leave a comment:


  • magman
    replied
    Re: Engine failure in flight in a Cessna 150

    A common way for water to enter the tank is from the Wells around the Filler Caps.

    Water is held for extended periods & some wicks down the screws & enters the tank.

    Brings along some rust as well.

    EZ fix is to seal the top of the screw with something I discovered years ago.

    RTV was used to seal shrouds in the Afterburner area of fighter aircraft.

    Works fine here.

    Do NOT ignore this.

    1. The rust may cause the Drain Valve not to seal.

    2. The very fine rust CAN move through the Strainers & into the Carb.

    At that point the Carb fails to function.

    Not good on ground.

    Worse in Flight!

    Leave a comment:


  • magman
    replied
    Re: Engine failure in flight in a Cessna 150

    Crazy Snow here in Buffalo area.

    Also crazy writing about a 150 on a Taylorcraft Forum.


    Oft overlooked is the BOTTOM Sump ; NOT the Firewall!

    Some have a Drain Valve added via STC.

    Most still have the AN Cap secured by a plate with a screw.

    Common to find water/trash there as it is the lowest point in the Fuel Sys.

    Ea as it is right below the Selector.sy to check

    Leave a comment:


  • magman
    replied
    Re: Engine failure in flight in a Cessna 150

    When I've encountered this it was like this.

    Carb Heat Oper. was normal @ typical 1700 RPM check on ground.

    However; in flight as when pulling heat ON while on downwind the RPM would drop a LOT & IMMEDIATELY.

    Likely the water that was trapped moved due to a higher volume of air in the duct.

    Higher Engine RPM & Airspeed would be the reason.

    The water would then splash on the hot muffler.

    The resultant STEAM in then ingested into the Carb.

    Throws the Combustion Process out of wack.


    A small hole between the wires is all you need.

    I usually use a #40 ( 3/32) as that is handy for me.

    Easy to pour water in & OP. Ck.

    All you need is a little drip.


    Since you are replacing the SCAT:

    1. Assure that the wire end and the string are captured by the clamp.

    2. Use RTV ( Room Temp Vulcanizing aka Silicone) & run a bead lengthwise to

    secure the string.

    If the string moves the duct WILL collapse.

    It will help the SCAT last much longer.


    Note that when I inspect 150's it is VERY common to find FOD

    in the Intake Duct Loop.

    Very accessible for birds provides straw & stones.

    Also it is TOOO handy when folks are working in the area

    so that screws placed nearby wind up in the duct.

    Per FAR there should not be a screen over the Inlet as

    it could easily become obstructed.

    A plug tied to the Cowl Plugs or Prop would be good.

    The problem does NOT originate in Flight.

    Good Luck!

    Leave a comment:


  • Adamo13
    replied
    Re: Engine failure in flight in a Cessna 150

    Here are some pictures to go with the book! One thing I found very interesting is the sump plug in the picture is only about a month old! How could so much residue form while it's soaking in 100LL in such a short time!? The rust debris was all removed from inside the tanks and most likely got there from being knocked off the inside of the filler neck while being refueled.

    Adam McPeck
    1950 Taylorcraft BC12-D N6627N
    1959 Cessna 150 N7950E
    Attached Files

    Leave a comment:

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