max xwind

[Ed O'Brien]

Re: max xwind

Tough landing a Colt? This one had big tires and then it's also got plenty of power with a short-coupled front end. Maybe it was just a bad day... but I danced with that Colt for nearly a mile on a 7500ft runway back in the 80s. I didn't like it much. I'm not good with horses either. My question would be... how did the airplane know?
With regards;
ED OBRIEN

[d.grimm]

Re: max xwind

Ed,
Was that a converted Colt? I found a PA20 wheel landing in a strong crosswind
requires a lot of my concentration.

[Larry Lyons]

Re: max xwind

My memories of the Colt are, you look down at about a 45 degree angle, pull the throttle and that is where you will land. Had the glide angle of a Brick! LOL I never once over shot the landing, push the nose down, flare, the speed just disappeared!
Larry

[Ragwing nut]

Re: max xwind

I got quite a bit of Tri-Pacer time too. The trick to those is to carry 50lbs in the baggage compartment when noone is in the rear seat. That tidbit is actually in the flight manual for when doing flight training.

The hardest thing I learned to fly was a YPF-7 Waco from the front seat. You are completely blind and if you think a Tri-Pacer falls like a rock, the Waco might as well be a boulder. From the rear seat is 10x better and much easier to fly. And the Hayes brakes that are on them were never very realiable either. It took me about 1 hour solid of touch and goes to get comfortable in the front seat.

Mike

[Ed O'Brien]

Re: max xwind

I can't remember if the Colt was a converted ol' milk-stool
PA22. It's been 25 years and I haven't seen the plane since. No wind issue that I can remember. I do recall there was a big ballooning bounce from the big balloon tires... which porpoised as I tried to get it under control... I added power late... tried both a wheel and 3 point as I'm skipping along the pavement... and finally took off for several hundred feet and then tried another landing midway down the runway which was goofy footed also but eventually worked out. Short wing Pipers are not inherently "tricky" they just land differently than cubs, T-Crafts, and Citabrias that I was used to. My Dad says the toughest plane to land is a Corsair on a Carrier. He did it enough to know. I have a cousin who used to bring a
big ol Navy Anti Sub Patrol plane on board carriers in the 60s... I can't remember the model... but he said if you did everything right you cleared the island by about 12 ft. Do it wrong and the Navy would ask for your wings... which is handy... because your wings were already in chunks on the deck. With regards; ED OBRIEN

[flyguy]

Re: max xwind

I just got back from going around the pattern a few time and from the results I think I have found the secret to sucessful flight in a Taylorcraft.

When you go out to fly do a half dozen landings of mixed types--then go flying.

Next time you go flying do a half dozen landings of mixed types--then go flying.

I also noted you can go around the pattern several times in just a few minutes, even flying outside the Helicopters. The 85T really gets up and down in a hurry.

DC

[tawadc95]

Re: max xwind

practice makes perfect.

[tawadc95]

Re: max xwind

I learned to fly in the family tripacer...between my great uncle and my dad they have been the only owners till last month.
what a great airplane,one of the finest kept aviation secrets. the airplane weighed 1100 lbs and we routinely loaded it with 1200 lbs,four adult males,full fuel and baggage( granted not exactly denver here but still 115 degrees ) and it never once had you feeling nervous about . been all over the U.S. in all kinds of weather and never squaked back at us. it would loop from level flight before you could get it to stall. fond memories!
mom prefers to get in and out of the 182 now and I wanted something "prettier" so it had to go.fortunately went to a friend since we were kids so I still get to fly it! life does have some luck to it every now and then. we really enjoyed the rate of descent that it had as we used it on several strips that ran from 800-1200 foot long and an 85 mph approach smoothed the landing right out.
IF ONLY IT WAS PRETTY MR. PIPER!

[CraigH]

Re: max xwind

Scared the crap out of myself (and probably my co-pilot) a few years back in Buena Vista Colorado. Landed with a 19G25 direct crosswind in nasty turbulance. This was in an F21B, and I was amazed that we pulled it off. Wheel landed on one main, and rolled along like that for a good 1000ft before we were able to plant the other main, then finally the tail. Elbows were flying everywhere, but the Tcraft has some pretty darned good aileron authority.

[flyguy]

Re: max xwind

Thanks for that input Craig, I think we are getting a good cross-section of a lot of experience here and that is always a good thing. I'm definately going to continue to practice different suff. Am getting back into a comfortable zone with the T now. Feels goooooood!
DC

[Pat Murphy]

Re: max xwind

I did not know that landing in a cross wind was a problem. When I soloed in Wichita Falls , kickapoo airport in 1957, I think that 90% of all landings made were cross wind. It was all a part of the landing. Came in handy several times later when landing a PA 12 in a cross wind in south Arkansas. I believe that the last one there was in a 30 to 35 MPH wind ,almost 90% to the runway. Had to have help taxiing back to the hanger. The T-craft could have handled the landing , if the pilot could make it.

[jim cooper]

Re: max xwind

I would never attempt a 30mph crosswind landing in a Taylorcraft. Most old time flight instructors would not even take you up as a student in this type condition as 30 mph meant that not only was the landing very dangerous but that you would be thrown all over the sky to boot. I hope others chime in here with high tail dragger time, especially those who have flown a Cessna 195 or a Stearman in 30 mph crosswinds.......and made it. I had alot of time in a super cruiser too, and 30 mph x wind in that was out of the question unless the situation was desperate ,which for me, it never was. The Stearman or the 195 wanted to ground loop BADLY at 15 mph xwinds, rudder control was gone and you wanted to exclaim "Awwwww...Sh---! TriPacer is another story, short wings, nose gear, etc. Still....30 mph crosswind, maybe yes, maybe no. Line a T-craft up beside a Tripacer and look at the wings relating to each other! The T-Craft looks like...and IS a GLIDER! with a motor. JC

[Dennis Keels]

Re: max xwind

It more about the pilot than the airplane.

[fearofpavement]

Re: max xwind

I was reviewing some of these older posts on this thread and I think this is one of those subjects that no matter how much beating it gets isn't going to die. So my take on it is this:

Every pilot has to be familiar enough with the plane to establish their own limitations and those limits need to be inside the operating envelope of the plane.

I have done a lot of landings (way more than 10,000) but from reading these posts my limits are more conservative than some here. Practice makes perfect but I don't have enough practice yet I guess...someday I'll figure it out.

There are two kinds of uncomfortable in weather, one is when you are getting beat around by turbulence and it isn't fun any more and the other is when you have that feeling that maybe it isn't a good time to be flying in the present conditions. I try to avoid both but especially the latter. I have found that as I have aged I don't feel like I have to prove anything. OK, once in a while maybe, but not as often. So my flying has become more conservative. So on many days, while I feel confident I could handle the conditions, I elect not to because I don't "have" to.

So to any newbie pilots on here, please don't think that because someone discusses landing in a hurricane on top of a semi trailer going through a tunnel that you should be able to do that as well or you are less of a pilot. Do what feels comfortable to you and if you sense that your box is way smaller than the plane's then go up with an experienced instructor and expand it. That brings a lot of satisfaction to your flying endeavors. (continuous improvement). Since they're not making these planes anymore let's not bend them up! Have fun, fly safe!

[Frank DeBartolo]

Re: max xwind

Great advice--and well said.

Frank D