landings and wind

[Ed O'Brien]

I'm looking for your best idea's and reports on you best techniques: Scenerio -- Windy (30 mph) pretty much down the runway, or maybe 10 degree deflection from centerline. Do you carry power into the landing? Just a bit, a little, or alot? Wheel landing? 3-point? I've been playing with my L2 and can't seem to smooth out windy landings.
I've tried several combinations and don't have it right. No crashes but plenty of butt-puckering ones.
What do you do?
With regards;
ED OBRIEN

[Dan Mahalak]

Re: landings and wind

Ed.

Living in Seward AK, we have lots of wind most the time. I try not to fly in 30 or greater if I can avoid it however.

But still, I am running 26 inch tires, so angle of attack is a little bit greater.
Personally, I like to bleed off speed in ground effect, and just before the t "breaks" I transition from a three point config to a tail low, wheel landing. And commit to the wheel landing. Makes the touchdown real gentle, slow and gives me time to feel how the wind is pushing on the aircraft, and I can get ready to apply brake as control authority is diminished on rollout.

just how one guy does it.

[Dano"T"]

Re: landings and wind

I do a similar tail low wheel landing....in excessive winds I always carry power as needed....each situation determines how much....the only high pucker time is doing the rudder dance until the tail settles for goood and for a short time after.....like my dad alway said "wiggle your toes"....even if it is calm and your doing a normal landing....keeps you remembering that these are rudder airplanes.

[fearofpavement]

Re: landings and wind

If the wind is pretty much down the runway and not gusting, I don't think anything needs to change regarding increased power or whatever except if you want to fly a typical shaped pattern you'll be carrying a lot of power to keep from landing a hundred yards short of the strip. When you get over the strip cut the power and land. Your ground speed will be very minimal of course and it may appear you're too slow. Now, while you are on the ground (and on the brakes if they work is when judicious use of power may be helpful for rudder authority. If you have been bouncing or ballooning it is probably from too high an airspeed. (the low ground speed can really fake you out, grab a glance at the airspeed indicator prior to touch down if able)

Getting to that point is one thing, taxiing in that kind of wind is another issue and if it is really blowing it would be prudent to get some wing walkers to help you get back to the tie down or hangar. I agree with the previous post that anything over 30 is really pushing the envelope especially in the ground handling area.

[Ed O'Brien]

Re: landings and wind

In Denver the wind can blow and tumble down the mountains and surprise us quick. While I agree 30mph is pushing it, sometimes you're already airborne and the plane is gas-bone-dry before the wind subsides. The only thing to do is "your best." In my case hearing the techiques of others gives me a bit more leeway.

The other days I hopped a couple and then set off for a close airport runway with the breeze down the centerline. I had to wait several hours for things to die down as my courage and rudder authority have their limits. Thanks for the tips and keep'em coming.
With regards; ED OBRIEN

[94973]

Re: landings and wind

when it's blowing 30mph, I go fishing instead of flying

[Ragwing nut]

Re: landings and wind

I flown in 30 mph wind once in a Taylorcraft and decided it was not in my best interest to do so thanking god i was in our F-21 w/ Cleaveland brakes. I always pratice engine out when landing. I have actually had to do it a few times and pays off. I only carry power on high performance aircraft like Bonanza or sometimes 182

mike

[Ed O'Brien]

Re: landings and wind

Tribe;
I'm going to put some baggage in the back and take some more weight with me... the last go around I was flying light. Just big 'ol me. The weather in Denver this weekend means it'll be fit for T&Gs but little else unless I'd like to have deicing installed. Winds will be 6-15mph... so I'll try some various combinations and see if I can smooth out my goofy-footed landings.

Good news is my brakes work fine. Bad news is my feet don't. That said, with enough practice, I'll be good enough to make it to Carnegie Hall -- or atleast the airport luncheonette without embarassment.
WIth regards;
EDD OBRIEN

[crispy critter]

Re: landings and wind

Ed,
I like wheel landing with a little extra speed...fly it on and see how it feels,if you decide its too risky then you still have speed to do a go-around without wait for the speed to come up.

[dedrekon]

Re: landings and wind

I concur.....without power you'll be flying a final that's so short you won't get set-up properly and you need the extra energy in case a go-round is needed.

Practice your wheel landings, nothing wheels lands like a TCraft!

V

[tawadc95]

Re: landings and wind

Ed,
this is my first time responding to anyone so I am not sure if my first response was sent.
I work alot in the wind with my L2 and have found a few things that seem to help.
Y ou can call me at 1530 713 2070 cell or 1530 673 5052 in the evenings p.d.t.

[acbuilder]

Re: landings and wind

Wind is a fickle thing at best. With the T craft wing loading your normal appraoch speed is 1.3 times VSO (speed on final ) then I would add up 50% of the wind velocity to account for wind gradient as you desend and have enough positive control in gusts. Commit to landing type and stick with it. Wind can almost sense indecision. Sure it will float. Use the wind to your advantage. Remember into the wind your ground speed will be greatly reduced. Be assertive know what you want and keep thinking ahead.
Once on the ground keep the yoke back -ALL THE WAY BACK-.

[Ed O'Brien]

Re: landings and wind

I went flying this morning in the L2. I placed about 30lbs of baggage in the rear seat and another 20lbs in the luggage area (this area is limited to 20lbs) I did about 10
landings, 8 were wheel landings. I think on those times when I'd attempted wheel landing before, I couldn't quite feel what the rear end was doing. I was reacting too slowly and not very smoothly.I'll get better at this "feel" but that is my current learning curve state. Anyway, with a bit more weight, a bit more experience, and less wind, I seem to have gotten wheel landings down to harmless if still not perfectly graceful. No power, a bit more speed (3-4 knots, maybe) and feeling my way all the way to touch (not anticipating and therefore forcing it) this seems to have worked best for me. Everything appears coming to right place at the right time. All good landings are actually just this way. Having the ground, the wheels, the airspeed, and
the stick/rudders all meet at a precise moment and place. Recognizing this place takes a little practice.

I've flown mostly Citabrias and they seem to want to 3 point. There's a good bit more nuance and touch in the L2. While I'm still learning what the L2 wants, I seem to be better and giving it what it needs. BUT, that can be said of everything one learns, I suppose. Thanks for the suggestions. I appreciate the feedback and todday I'm happier with the results.
With regards;
ED OBRIEN

[mhorowit]

Re: landings and wind

Ed - for wheel landings I found landing with 1200RPM allowed me to keep the AOA I needed to land level - Mike

[Ed O'Brien]

Re: landings and wind

Mohorowit;
I tried a couple wheelies with power. Although I can't tell you how much power... but a scoosh of throttle all the same. Two things.
1. I seemed to be too flat for my liking. Hanging with not great frontal vision (you know, in that moment just before you stick forward, pop the tail up, and force the wheels to the pavement). I like staying high and crabbing or slipping then centering up as I pass the threshold. Although there more of a chance that you'll "J' the flare this way -- It gives me a good view and keeps me out of trouble incase the engine hiccups.
2. I was uncoordinated on the controls and skipped a bit.
Reducing power while fighting cross wind... is just one more thing to do. As I said, I think I'm a little rough yet for
this one.
That said, it doesn't mean you're wrong. I'm still goofing with it and figuring it out. I can see doing this landing with power manuever in a higher breeze than I had today.
Thanks and with regards; ED OBRIEN