Bubble Face Compass

[Hank Jarrett]

Re: Bubble Face Compass

OK, who got it?
Hank

[crispy critter]

Re: Bubble Face Compass

Wasn't me, I was going to bid but once she passed $300 I was out,lol.

[M Towsley]

Re: Bubble Face Compass

I chose not to bid on this one. I didn't like the glass, it looked more like a plastic replacement with scratches and dents. Also couldn't see the internals very well. The problem is some folks are buying these as investments, a friend of mine is snapping up bubble-faced compasses, Taylorcraft or not, to later sell. He did not buy this one, however.

[Bravo 6]

Re: Bubble Face Compass

I am the one that purchased the compass on ebay. I am hoping that I am ending up with a restorable compass? Hank, I might be looking for more of your input on getting it restored/serviceable?

[Hank Jarrett]

Re: Bubble Face Compass

Sure thing. I have done two now and there are a few things to know to prevent some serious problems. First (and I told this to the seller too) you need to have the package shipped with the "radioactive material inside" code on the box. I am pretty sure you CAN NOT ship it through the U.S. mail! Check with FedEx and UPS. If they don't know it at the local shipping site I know the Keystone guys know what it is. Basically, the radiation detectors in the system since 911 have everyone safety wired in the super cautious mode and they will drop it in a drum and send it away as radioactive waste (and CHARGE YOU for the disposal of your compass) without the markings.
When you get it, the glass is IMPOSSIBLE to have made. I talked to companies that make lenses for NASA telescopes and they wouldn't touch making one. Those little screws that hold the front on have to be tightened in order and to the right torque in steps. Screw it up and you could crack the lens. I WOULD NOT recommend you take it apart unless you know what you are doing. If you DO decide to take it apart, the compass card is painted with Radium paint (why it is mildly radioactive) and the contaminated fluid is DANGEROUS. You also have to have a special license to handle it (which I wouldn't if I even HAD the license).
Now with all the scary words over, there is a light at the end of the tunnel (other than the one from the Radium). Keystone instruments has all the licenses and as I remember the charge for disposal of the Radium and fluid was $25 or $50 when they rebuilt mine. They COMPLETELY rebuild the compass including all new finish on the card (with no Radium), sealed case with new fluid ready to go back in your dome case and into your plane.
The second good news is the dome is very soft aluminum and the dents and marks are no problem. You will probably want to strip the finish with stripper or soda blast it (DO NOT SAND BLAST IT OR WIRE BRUSH IT!!!) You may find it has been "fixed" with Bondo or crummy aluminum welding (mine were). The Bondo will probably pop out when you blast it. If not you might be able to just push on the dent on the inside and it will pop off. Any dents in the dome you can actually push out with a tea spoon. Just press gently and rub the curve of the spoon on the dent to push it back out. When you get the big ones out you can put filler on to smooth it out but you should only need less than 1/32". I didn't end up with any filler on mine and the sandable primer filled any irregularities. I DID have to shrink the edge a little where a prior repair attempt had stretched it making it loose on the compass. The screw in the front of the dome is just a BRASS straight slot screw that holds the compass in the dome. You could use a high Nickel SS screw but if you get a low Nickel one it can screw up the calibration.
When you get it let me know and we can go from there. They look REALLY good in the plane!
Hank

[M Towsley]

Re: Bubble Face Compass

Congrats, Greg, I'm glad someone here got it for use in a plane. I know where there is one somewhat locally but can't get the guy to let go yet. Good luck with the restoration!

[Bravo 6]

Re: Bubble Face Compass

Thanks Hank and Marty. I just sent a message to Keystone instruments checking on quotes and insure they can overhaul the compass. I will follow your great instructions on repairing the housing Hank. I will keep you posted on my progress.

Marty, good luck getting that compass!

[barnstmr]

Re: Bubble Face Compass

What is a BF Compass like this worth? Are these unique to only pre-war Taylorcrafts? A/ B models only?

[Hank Jarrett]

Re: Bubble Face Compass

I have about $1,000 in one for one of my planes. You can do better than that, but at the time it was the first one I had ever seen except in photos and I bought it from a museum. The one in the photo should go for a LOT less! It will cost several hundred to have it overhauled to working order and a LOT of hand work to clean up the dome mount and make the exterior look presentable.
If the one in the photo was for sale I would pay no more than $150 for it considering all the corrosion on it.

Hank

Of course, I HAVE two now. Makes a BIG difference when you don't actually NEED one!

[3Dreaming]

Re: Bubble Face Compass

What is a BF Compass like this worth? Are these unique to only pre-war Taylorcrafts? A/ B models only?

I think the A's and early B's had a differents style mounted on a hump top center of the instrument panel. When they switched to the bullet mount they used it until till maybe 41. After the war they used surplus B16 with a flat front.

[M Towsley]

Re: Bubble Face Compass

Tom,

I thought a bubble-faced compass mounted on the windshield was appropriate for the postwar BC-12's. But what do I know, I just thought they were cool looking and the mount is still on the windshield in my plane. What would be appropriate?

[Hank Jarrett]

Re: Bubble Face Compass

I know they were original equipment in 41 on the Deluxe (there was no compass at all as standard before the war, it was an option). The bubble face was also standard in 45 on the Deluxe but I would need to dig through the old photos to see if it was on other models. I seem to remember seeing them in advertisement photos but you need to be careful, they sometimes used pictures of earlier planes in the advertising. I know for sure NEC-36296 and NC-43196 had the bubble face. It is listed in the paperwork on both as original equipment.

Hank

I had an old timer tell me when I was surprised planes before the war didn't even have ANY compass as standard that he never needed one. Every barn had an arrow on one side of the roof with a big arrow and usually the other side had an arrow and a town name that was close by. Sometimes the good ole days really were.

[N-43121]

Re: Bubble Face Compass

Hank,

I found a bubble face compass a year or so ago and sent it off to a place in California to have it restored. Very happy with the work! This thread got me inspired to start work on the "can" today. Working on getting a couple dents out. It also needs to be "shrunk a bit" for a better fit around the compass. How did you do that?

Also, I read your comment about a brass slot screw to hold the compass in the can. I may have screwed up because I loosened the nut on the back of the compass and some fluid leaked out. Now the threaded stud is turning and I can't get the nut to tighten back up. I don't quite see how the compass attaches in the can. Can you enlighten me?

Rod

[Hank Jarrett]

Re: Bubble Face Compass

The best way to get the dents out is to "spoon" them from the inside. The aluminum is really soft and will push back out pretty easy, but it will also stretch which is bad. They call it "spooning" because the tool looks like a spoon. You can use an actual tea spoon or make a tool from wood. The idea is to press GENTLY so you don't stretch the metal. A smooth rounded dowel works well too, just DON'T hit it! Imagine the metal is like clay and you are pushing it together to make it thicker and shrink up the outside surface. If you work it gently you can actually make that happen.

On the open end where it is bigger in diameter you actually bend the metal into a "wave" (again, GENTLY so it doesn't stretch!) and then tap it back flat making the high area get thicker as it goes down. That will reduce the length in the area you are shrinking. Try it first on a flat piece of soft aluminum. I had a piece of curved hard wood I put inside and shrank the edges against. It really does work, but you need patience. I watched someone good at it make a flat sheet into a bowl by shrinking the edges. He then tapped it flat again to show he could do it. AMAZING!

Try it first on a piece of pie crust. It has the same problems. If you work pie crust too much it hardens and cracks. Same as Aluminum. If you work it carefully you can make the surface of the crust smaller and the thickness will increase. When you are through working the crust sprinkle it with sugar and cinnamon and bake it till it browns. No sense wasting it. ;-) Don't do it to the aluminum. Tastes terrible. You CAN anneal the Aluminum by "sooting" it with a candle and then burning the soot off with a soft torch flame but you might want to take it to someone who has done it before. Aluminum goes from solid to soft to liquid with almost NO WARNING. You could destroy the dome in a heartbeat!

I wish I could help you on the loose nut, but it is NOT supposed to leak there! Somehow you have made a passage from the pressure compensator to the outside. That isn't good, but you need someone with more experience working on them to help fix it. Mine never leaked from the rear nut.

Hank

[N-43121]

Re: Bubble Face Compass

Thanks Hank. Did yours have a screw that went from the can into the back of the compass, or did the threaded stud extend through the back of the can?