1939 Model BC-65 4 Piece Windshield

[NC22211]

Let's start this up again: I have a good one-piece windshield, but the original had the 4 piece installed. My thoughts were to use the one-piece and cut it into the 4 piece style for originality's sake. Has anyone done this, and what were the results? I have had heard the suggestion that someone used trim strips and drilled into a one-piece windshield, attaching the trim strips as if it were in 4 pieces. Any successes there?

The obvious solution is to make the correct 4 pieces and do it the way CG did in 1939. Problem is that I haven't got a pattern to go by, just some old photos. Anyone been-there-done-that and have patterns or suggestions? Thanks gang. We are ordering covering supplies right now! Major Milestone for this project. Bob C. NC22211

[Dick Huish]

Re: 1939 Model BC-65 4 Piece Windshield

I have added the trim on several L-2 windshields. It looks original but gives the added strength of the thicker material. I'm sure it's stronger,quieter and less prone to leak. If my memory is right the original was made with .080 material which is hard to find. Dick

[Hank Jarrett]

Re: 1939 Model BC-65 4 Piece Windshield

I just finished the 4 piece on my 41. Getting everything to fit was a BEAR, but should be a LOT easier to do again with the templates I have now. The most expensive part was getting the windshield (the front piece) cut and drilled at a plastics shop. I made the windscreens (the side pieces) myself as well as the top "glass". Whatever you plan to do be sure to get drill bits designed specifically for drilling plastic. The tales of running the bit backwards, melting holes, drilling at different speeds, etc. etc. etc. are all BUNK. Drilling that many holes, you WILL break the plastic if you don't use the right bit, whether you are drilling a one piece or the original design.
Something to think about is that the Feds will probably not look kindly to drilling holes in a one piece and you could end up with a pretty, but useless windshield. Check with your IA before you start drilling holes. You might want to look at some aluminum tape painted to match the plane with round drops of epoxy to make the rivets. It would look right but not compromise the "glass". I would even check that out with my IA before I did it.
Hank
Let me know if you want tracings of my parts.

[Hank Jarrett]

Re: 1939 Model BC-65 4 Piece Windshield

Bob,
I just checked your personal info and I live in Virginia Beach and my 41 is at Suffolk. I'm just down the road so let me know if there is a time you want to get together and you can get all the measurements, tracings and pictures you need. I can also give you enough busted plexy to practice drilling holes for hours (like I said, the wrong drill will break a LOT of glass).
Hank
Want to borrow some of the right drill bits?

[NC22211]

Re: 1939 Model BC-65 4 Piece Windshield

Hank:

I do have the plastic drill bits, and I know about over-sizing the holes slightly to allow for expansion. Thanks for the advice, though. Yes, I would like to copy your templates and patterns, but I'm not sure when I can get to Suffolk. This summer, yes, but a date, I don't know. I'll be in the paint booth most of June covering and shooting dope on the '39 BC-65. Maybe after that. Cewrtainly appreciate the offer. Regards, Bob

[Hank Jarrett]

Re: 1939 Model BC-65 4 Piece Windshield

Bob,
Sent you a PM and some information. I guess we can continue here for the benefit of the tribe and anyone else who wants to go back to the original windshield. One thing I didn't mention in the PM is when I drilled my holes oversize I made hundreds of little vinyl spacers for each hole so the SS Screw threads wouldn't touch the Plexiglas. The threads can cause stress risers in the plastic and create crack sources. The original 4 piece used squeezed rivets (have fun finding a rivet squeezer with a throat THAT deep these days!) but every reproduction I have seen so far used 1/8" screws. I used SS screws and nuts to avoid magnetized fasteners close to the compass and even the cheapest SS screws are MUCH stronger than the rivets, which were MUCH stronger than what was needed.
Does anyone in the tribe have any old pictures of the base of the windscreen and windshield where it lays over the boot cowl? I am trying to confirm if a fastener went through the bottom to the two aluminum strips, through the boot and into the small metal tabs welded on the tubes behind the strips.
Bob and I will keep working on this and hopefully I or we can create a set of photos and drawings of the process so anyone else who wants to go back to original will have a head start.
Hank

By the way, the metal strips seem to have almost NO effect on visibility! They are right behind the tubes and from my time sitting in the plane I hardly ever notice them. Another airport myth bites the dust!

[Ray36048]

Re: 1939 Model BC-65 4 Piece Windshield

Yes, photos would be great. I have a 41 delux. Not sure if it had a one piece or not. I don't think it had a metal strip at the boot cowl. I have no ides how it is secured to what.

[3Dreaming]

Re: 1939 Model BC-65 4 Piece Windshield

Pre war would have been 4 piece. When I did mine the sample of frame and glass we had access to used 1/8" round head soft solid rivets. That is what I put it back together with. I had to modify a universal rivet set. Tom

[Hank Jarrett]

Re: 1939 Model BC-65 4 Piece Windshield

PICTURES guys, PICTURES!
My new 4 piece is on the plane and I will post some pictures as soon as I can get out to take some (come on, Mothers Day was today!).
I am REALLY interested in any evidence that a fastener went through the lower ends of the metal strips through the boot cowl. The other thing is, I broke one of the windscreens (the side pieces cracked out from a bad drill hole) and with a vertical split from top to bottom the whole assembly gets SCARY loose! Are we all SURE there was no fastener going through the boot to that tab on the tubes?
Hank

Anybody with some pieces of the original "glass", how thick were the original pieces? Maybe my windscreen pieces were too thin.

[NC22211]

Re: 1939 Model BC-65 4 Piece Windshield

We hung the boot cowl Sunday to see what was going on at the windshield. Observations about an original boot cowl: the back of the boot cowl, where the windshield bottom pieces rest, has a groove rolled into it which forms a pocket for the plexiglas to rest in. There are traces of black sealant(?) in that groove, as if the 'glas was set by sealant. The groove is like one of the 3/16 grooves you'd roll into aluminum with a Pexto metal roller. It follows the curved trailing edge of the top of the boot cowl. Behind the groove, the alum. is flanged up at about 60 degrees and drilled at about 2" intervals. The holes were to hold the one piece replacement windshield at the bottom. They honestly do look to have been drilled at a later date, not original. From the rub pattern, it appears the windshield went on the outside of this flange. There is no corresponding outer trim piece in the bucket of parts marked "windshield", so we are guessing there was none. The boot cowl has no tabs or obvious corresponding attach points on the fuselage tubing. It appears it was held on the fuselage by the 4 engine mount bolts and the screws along the sides.

There are more than one of us who think the windshield pieces were just laid into that lower groove, without the large quantity of screws, holes, stress points, and so on. Certainly there is a definitive answer out here in pre-war Taylorcraft Land!

Hank: If I can purchase copies of your templates and patterns - whether in beer or bucks - it would be a welcomed step forward! I will take some photos, but I may need help getting them posted. Haven't done that yet.

Thanks to all! BC

[Hank Jarrett]

Re: 1939 Model BC-65 4 Piece Windshield

Tracings of all parts are free. We need to help each other out. Just understand that my "glass" is about as likely to fit your plane without modification as Rush Limbaugh is to announce he has joined the Democratic party.
I have some of the templates at home but the rest are with the plane. This week "should" be a light one since I don't start my new contract till the 15th, so I am hoping to use some of my stored up leave to work on the plane. After the 15th I start as the Level II Systems Engineer on Constellation so I may not even SEE my plane for a while. I will get the tracings before that happens.
Hank

Everybody say a short prayer today. The Hubble mission launches at 14:01 this afternoon. The NASA Safety people have done a great job getting ready and prepping for everything they can, but a little help from an even higher altitude never hurts. There is no safe haven for this mission at ISS and this is the last time we will see two Orbiters on the pads at the same time.
Ever notice the Shuttle has an 6 piece windshield? (If you don't count the two top windows)