Newbie Rebuild Questions

[Texas]

I recently bought a 1946 Swick conversion Taylorcraft and need help getting started with the rebuild. Everything is apart and awaiting clean up and assembly. My questions are:

1) What is the best finish for the fuselage tubing?

2) What is the suggested welding method, tig or o/a?

3) Should the ribs be refinished, what finish is best and how is that accomplished?

4) Is there anyone near Beaumont, TX rebuilding a plane I can see and take picture of for my reference.

5) Is there such thing as as a hardware, nuts, bolts and screw list in existence? I checked with the major suppliers with no luck.

Sorry about the laundry list, but I am new to rebuilding and lost as anyone could be.

Thanks

Phil

[Hank Jarrett]

Re: Newbie Rebuild Questions

Your whole list can be filled in, but not all at once. You are also going to get LOTS of opinions! Listen to the support and make your choices. If you get actual BAD advice, there will be enough fireworks and "discussions" to make it clear someone is in the small minority.
My opinion, and this is MY opinion, would be two coats of epoxy primer after sand blasting. The metal will be kind of "white" so I start with red tinted primer (easy to see good coverage). After all the "white" is covered with red, I prime again with white primer. When the red is all gone, I painted the tubes with an epoxy paint tinted the same color as the original Zinc Chromate primer used right after the war. I painted all the tubes with a super cheap Harbor Freight hobby airbrush. Reach through and paint the inside of the fuselage first working your way out. You get a LOT less primer on your shirt that way. ;-)
I used about 1/4 the epoxy with the airbrush because there was no over spray. The fan was about 1" and so was the tube. Lots of people laughed till they saw how well it worked. Look for the sprayers with the GLASS bottles. The plastic ones work, but get soft and are messy as well as impossible to clean. I eventually made a bottle from a salsa jar that held a lot more paint by gluing the jar lid to the bottom of the air brush. I was originally going to buy about 6 or 8 brushes and just throw them away, but they cleaned up great and I think I still have 4 in the boxes.

I am not a welder so I will defer to someone who is for the next question. My fuselage was done with O/A and inert gas depending on where the weld was.

Hank

You will probably end up getting fastener answers one bolt at a time, but there is a small group here trying to make a list. JOIN IT!

[TimHicks]

Re: Newbie Rebuild Questions

Phil,
When I tore my '46 BC-12D apart recently, I recorded every fastener in a spreadsheet.
I did this mainly to use as a shopping list for new fasteners for when I put it back together.
My post-war fuselage is married to pre-war wings and tail. So my list is probably unique to my airplane.
And it's not really easy to read and understand.
But if you think it might be a useful reference, send me a PM with your email address and I'll send you the spreadsheet.

[Texas]

Re: Newbie Rebuild Questions

Hank,

Thanks for the reply. I am truly lost and trying to find my way.... I appreciate any and all help.

My first project will most likely be the wings but I need to get the fuselage out of the way to make room for the wing build. So off to the sand blaster for prep and a good inspection.

Is there any written information anywhere on what goes where and a process for rebuilding a Taylorcraft? Most of my plane is in Rubbermaid tubs. I am slowly learning the parts as I find pictures on the internet. A book titled "Taylorcrafts for Dummies" would be a hit in my shop right now.

Phil

[Hank Jarrett]

Re: Newbie Rebuild Questions

I don't know about "Taylorcraft for Dummies" but some of us consider ourselves "Taylorcraft BY Dummies"! It really isn't as bad as it probably looks to you right now. You are going the right direction. Get the fuselage blasted and primed, then have an old timer show you how to "poke" the tubes to check for internal rust. Mark every bad spot with a marking pen and don't get discouraged, lots of planes have LOTS of rust holes. Each one is just a small project. Once all the rust is taken care of you will probably need to re-blast parts of the tubes and prime and paint again.

When you have your space open for the wings, hang one up as your guide and start on the other. DON'T TAKE THEM BOTH APART AT THE SAME TIME!!!! It will be like a jig-saw-puzzle with no picture! Right now, start a thread and title it with your name and the N number of the plane and post lots of pictures. The guys on here LOVE to look at each others planes and we will help guide you. We will look for things that have been done wrong before and it is REALLY a lot of fun to figure out what the "mystery part" is. Don't be surprised if you find an occasional Cessna or Piper part in those baskets.

Don't throw ANYTHING away. That rotten piece of wood is the pattern you will need later and the rusty bolt will tell you what size you need to order. Put everything in freezer bags and write where you got it on the bag. If it's too big for the bag, write it on the part. Even a smashed windshield will help when you get the new one.

These planes were built in a factory with less sophistication than the average home workshop now. It is just a bunch of little projects that come together as an airplane.

Hank

you aren't lost, it just seems like it. You are on a well worn path a lot of us have walked already and we will show you the way. Right now the visibility is just really bad.

[Texas]

Re: Newbie Rebuild Questions

Too late Hank, it is in the same Rubbermaid tubs I brought the plane home in. I want to find a Taylorcraft in pieces locally that I can look at. I thought about buying a salvage wing to copy. I do have the Swick plans which lays thing out dimensionally.

Phil

[Hank Jarrett]

Re: Newbie Rebuild Questions

If your wings are both all in pieces all is not lost. I have several here, uncovered with different kinds of damage. Post some pictures of the kind of ribs you have and the parts from the tubs and I will send you some photos of what it looks like together (photos ship easy, a built up wing is kind of expensive).

There are some "gotchas" in the wings on things like the compression struts (the tubes between the spars). Measure them CAREFULLY, they are slightly different lengths and you need to put them in the right places. Sort them and tag them. There should be a bunch of oval shaped shims that go between the struts and the spars to shim them. The ribs are different too. Some are flanged to the right and some to the left, some are aileron ribs (the short ones) and some are nose ribs (the REALLY short ones).

There should be some root ribs (doubled ribs that go next to the fuselage) and probably some wing tanks and fuel plumbing fittings. Look for a bunch of castings for the hinges and some welded up steel parts for the wing strut attaches and the spar to fuselage attach fittings. There should be a bunch of wires that are threaded on each end with fittings screwed on them. Those are the drag and anti-drag wires, DON'T BEND THEM and DON'T LET EM GET RUSTY! It isn't hard work, just tedious. Once some parts are identified you can start restoring them and building a box of parts for assembly, where you will feel like you are accomplishing something.

Once you have the ribs identified one of the guys here (Ray B.) used a soda blaster on his and then primed them. His wing came out GREAT! I plan to buy one and do the same on my next wing. Harbor Freight sells them for about $100 (yea, they are Chinese and I like to buy American too. Find me a company in the US that makes the thing and I will buy it instead).

Post a few photos of your parts pile at a time (not 8 or 10, it will just get all confused). If you lay a bunch of ribs down with letters or numbers and take a photo we can tell you which is which.

Wish Texas wasn't so far from Virginia.

Hank

[Mark Julicher]

Re: Newbie Rebuild Questions

Hey Phil,
Do you ever get near San Antonio? We have 3 Taylorcraft and a couple Aeroncas in various stages of rebuild.
There are probably some re-builders closer to you, but any time you want to kick tires and talk rebuilding - come on over!
I work at Bulverde Intergalactic Spaceport (1T8) almost every day.

Incidentally, I bought my T-craft in boxes in 1985 and had the same bewildered feelings.
No question too trivial, no mistake that can't be fixed. The Taylorcraft Tribe is here to help.

[Texas]

Re: Newbie Rebuild Questions

Mark,

Intergalactic Spaceport sound interesting. We have a school board and city council here, that I would like to ship out from your spaceport:-)

I will contact you when I find time to fly in and learn, your offer is appreciated.



Thanks for the post.

Phil

[Mark Julicher]

Re: Newbie Rebuild Questions

Phil,
I believe is was Bobby Kennedy that was once quoted as saying, "...as corrupt as Beaumont, Texas..."
I was married at the cathedral there and have family ties in the area. It is always an interesting city.

Meanwhile, If you are proficient with TIG, go ahead and weld with it. Oxy-Fuel is tried and true or course, but both will give good results in the hands of a competent welder. The main thing is to get started and don't get caught up in "paralysis by analysis."

[Hank Jarrett]

Re: Newbie Rebuild Questions

If you DO get caught up in "paralysis by analysis" just let me know, I'm an expert at it.

Hank

I don't know how to get out of it, but I'm an expert at getting in to it.

[Richh2only]

Re: Newbie Rebuild Questions

Another good spray gun available also at Harbor Freight is the 20 oz. HVLP Gravity Spray Gun. They run them on sale anywhere between $9.99 and $15.99, you will also need a pressure regulator and in line air dryer to make it work. Total cost about $35.00, you can adjust the spray pattern down to 3/4" wide and it cleans of quite eaisly. This is what I used to prime and paint all my tubular parts.
Good luck on your project

[Robert Lees]

Re: Newbie Rebuild Questions

If you DO get caught up in "paralysis by analysis" just let me know, I'm an expert at it.

Hank

I don't know how to get out of it, but I'm an expert at getting in to it.

Hank, you owe me a cup of coffee and a new keyboard!!!!

[Hank Jarrett]

Re: Newbie Rebuild Questions

That figures, you drink coffee and I drink tea.
Hank

[Pearson]

Re: Newbie Rebuild Questions

There are some "gotchas" in the wings on things like the compression struts (the tubes between the spars). ......... There should be a bunch of wires that are threaded on each end with fittings screwed on them. Those are the drag and anti-drag wires, DON'T BEND THEM and DON'T LET EM GET RUSTY!

Phil,

Hank and the others are giving you some really good advice. I would like to add a caution regarding the wires that go in the wings. They are cadmium plated. If you see any of it flaking off, be careful. It is considered hazmat. You do not want to sand it off or even handle it. Hank what would you do with peeling cadmium on the drag wires?

Regarding the welding, the fuselages were originally gas welded. You can weld on them with TIG or gas. I would use whichever you are most proficient with. If you take it to a welding shop, they will probably use TIG.

From my personal experience I can tell you that organization is very important on a project as large as restoring a plane. I keep a clipboard near my project to take notes on. It will make reassembly MUCH easier if you tag & bag everything. A minute spent tagging and bagging will save an hour on assembly.

Also, don't forget to consult an AD list for your plane. Keep notes on how you plan to comply with each one during the process. One AD is an inspection of the lower strut attach fitting. I plan to install a small removable panel around the fitting to allow easier inspection. I believe it is just a one time inspection, but these things have a way of becomming recurring. There is a list of mods on the Taylorcraft.org website. Now is the time to check to see if there are any you want to do to your plane.

As far as painting the ribs, they came originally with no finish on them. Some folks paint them, some do not. If I were going to paint my ribs, I would use a primer I saw a guy use on his Murphy Moose. He called it "wash primer". It was made by PPG, and the interesting thing about it was you could see the metal through it. It looked like the ribs had been anodized. They had that gold color, but sort of like gold tinted clear. The thing I like about it is that it doesn't add a lot of weight. I don't recall an actual product name, but I am sure with the wealth of knowledge here someone will come up with it.