Is airplane re-cover a 337 or a logbook entry?

[skyboltone]

Title says it all. An airplane I'm interested in has no 337 for re-cover with Stitts in 2005 on record with FAA. The owner insists that it is in annual and the recover was done in accordance with 43-13 and signed off by an A&P.

[magman]

Re: Is airplane re-cover a 337 or a logbook entry?

Definitely a Major Repair & should have a 337.

It would require a sigature by an IA.

Perhaps there is a paper copy?

Not unusual for a copy to not be sent.

A possibility is that the IA would not approve the job for some reason.

Can you contact the A & P?

[lawheelock]

Re: Is airplane re-cover a 337 or a logbook entry?

It is my understanding that if the recover was done in accordance with an STC that has been signed for the particular plane, then a 337 is submitted to FAA at Oklahoma City but does not have to have a FSDO submission or sign off. It has to be signed by the installing A&P and approved by an IA. A copy of the completed 337 and a copy of the STC and an appropriate log entry will become a part of the aircraft records.
Larry Wheelock, Taylorcraft N96179, A&P, IA

[skyboltone]

Re: Is airplane re-cover a 337 or a logbook entry?

Thanks guys. That's what I thought. There are clearly things out of place. The owner says he has all receipts etc and a logbook sign off. No copy of a 337. It's too bad that they didn't take the time to do it right. It was recovered under the supervision of so and so. I have so and so's name and mechanic number.

[magman]

Re: Is airplane re-cover a 337 or a logbook entry?

I agree with lawheelock on this.

A 337 could still be done on this.

A "Show-stopper" could be the "Why wasn't it signed?" .

It could well be the IA was not contacted until the fabric was on & never saw the structure.

I know of a J-3 where the engine was "o'h'd" & lot's of receipts.

However; compression was low on break-in & it was never signed.

The A & P has passed.

Aircraft flew this way for 20 years.

[Guest]

Re: Is airplane re-cover a 337 or a logbook entry?

Definitely a Major Repair & should have a 337.

It would require a sigature by an IA.

Perhaps there is a paper copy?

Not unusual for a copy to not be sent.

A possibility is that the IA would not approve the job for some reason.

Can you contact the A & P?

If the IA did not approve he should have rejected the 337, that's the procedure.

Notice that a 337 has an approve and reject to select.

So it seems likely that there was not a 337 or it has been lost.

Try getting the aircraft CD from Oklahoma City.

Dave

[skyboltone]

Re: Is airplane re-cover a 337 or a logbook entry?

If the IA did not approve he should have rejected the 337, that's the procedure.

Notice that a 337 has an approve and reject to select.

So it seems likely that there was not a 337 or it has been lost.

Try getting the aircraft CD from Oklahoma City.

Dave

That's how I came to find out there is no 337! I have the CD from the feds.

[Guest]

Re: Is airplane re-cover a 337 or a logbook entry?

eek!

yeah that plane has a problem

[NY86]

Re: Is airplane re-cover a 337 or a logbook entry?

Appendix A to Part 43 — Major Alterations, Major Repairs, and Preventive Maintenance

(b) Major repairs —(1) Airframe major repairs. Repairs to the following parts of an airframe and repairs of the following types, ... are airframe major repairs.
...
(xxvii) Replacement of fabric on fabric covered parts such as wings, fuselages, stabilizers, and control surfaces.

All major repairs require a 337.

[dejh22]

Re: Is airplane re-cover a 337 or a logbook entry?

Ok...if the 337 was not done or lost what does a person do to fix it? I know of a couple aircraft that were supervised and OKed, but a 337 was not filed. Maybe lost or never turned in. The aircraft are still flying today. This was 30 years ago.

Dale
N5059M

[fearofpavement]

Re: Is airplane re-cover a 337 or a logbook entry?

You have two issues here. One is that there is no 337 filed for the major repair. the other is that the Stitts process is a major alteration from the original fabric the plane was certified with. This will require an STC and accompanying 337.

This is not the end of the world. An IA can file the paperwork retroactively and get the logs straightened out. A big factor would be the quality of the recover job. If it is good work many IA's would probably be willing to give a close look and if they felt comfortable with it could get the plane squared away. If the recover job looks substandard, you may have a hard time getting someone to sign it off.

This is the same procedure that would be used if someone was doing repairs on an aircraft and died before they completed the paperwork.

Long story short on the plane in question is that the plane is not airworthy. If I were you, I would inform the owner of the "complications" and walk away. There are other planes out there that aren't encumbered by these paperwork issues. Inform the seller that if he/she gets the logs fixed up to let you know. Although it would take a while for the CD to reflect updates. So I would just walk. Whoever is doing the annuals may be willing to fix the paperwork.

[magman]

Re: Is airplane re-cover a 337 or a logbook entry?

It may be worthwhile to contact the A & P before a final decision.

Maybe there IS a 337 "somewhere".

No one really HAS to sign a 337 unless they are comfortable with the whole process.

Both the owner & the A & P may recognize they are in an unenviable legal position on this since the aircraft has flown

without "Approval for Return to Service".

Many owners have their paperwork in a real mess.

337's are often scattered in several areas.

2 years ago I was involved with 2 aircraft ( 1 a T) that apparently had the

wrong engines installed.

Eventually 337's were there. 1 new 1 old

[akndrifter]

Re: Is airplane re-cover a 337 or a logbook entry?

It is my understanding that if the recover was done in accordance with an STC that has been signed for the particular plane, then a 337 is submitted to FAA at Oklahoma City but does not have to have a FSDO submission or sign off. It has to be signed by the installing A&P and approved by an IA. A copy of the completed 337 and a copy of the STC and an appropriate log entry will become a part of the aircraft records.
Larry Wheelock, Taylorcraft N96179, A&P, IA

This makes no sense to me. If there is an STC for an aircraft, then no 337 is needed...

[Dano"T"]

Re: Is airplane re-cover a 337 or a logbook entry?

This makes no sense to me. If there is an STC for an aircraft, then no 337 is needed...

When you do a Major repair or alteration even if there is an STC you still need a 337....it's just that as long as your AP/IA signs it it's automatically approved....they just reference the STC # in the comments...."entire aircraft recovered in accordance with STC such and such" People sometimes mistake a 337 as a field approval document....it is...but it is also needed when you modify your aircraft under an STC.

[Guest]

Re: Is airplane re-cover a 337 or a logbook entry?

When you do a Major repair or alteration even if there is an STC you still need a 337....it's just that as long as your AP/IA signs it it's automatically approved....they just reference the STC # in the comments...."entire aircraft recovered in accordance with STC such and such" People sometimes mistake a 337 as a field approval document....it is...but it is also needed when you modify your aircraft under an STC.

well its almost that simple...

see part 91.403(d)
(d) A person must not alter an aircraft based on a supplemental type certificate unless the owner or operator of the aircraft is the holder of the supplemental type certificate, or has written permission from the holder.

This translates to one needs written persmission for the aircraft and it must be given by aircraft serial number.

Its more than an casual comment or reference is my only point.

Dave