Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

N95598: Fuel Tank Surprising Discovery

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • N95598: Fuel Tank Surprising Discovery

    Lesson learned... Gascolator checks and sump drains may not suffice.

    It is hard to describe the feelings of surprise, relief, and bewilderment yesterday when we found out what an awful mess has been lurking inside my main fuel tank. To me... this is enough to cause me to NEVER use mogas ever again in an airplane. I guess that its ok if you fly regularly, but here's what can happen if you let mogas stagnate and set in your fuel tanks. This discovery yesterday came as a surprise because we recently thoroughly cleaned and flushed out the fuel tank during annual inspection. Since the annual, I have flown exclusively with avgas for around 8 hours with no hint of a fuel contamination problem. And I check and drain the gascolator before each flight. There has not even been one speck drained out on any flight. Same went for yesterday's pre-flight. I might have continued with this major problem unknowingly had I not made a unusual decision yesterday.

    I was about to make an hour-long flight and I was debating about whether to plan a stop for fuel. The fuel float indicator was showing maybe a little less than half (I was thinking maybe 5 or 6 gallons). So I asked Lon (my father in law) to borrow the dipstick he has for his '39 tcraft. (This was the unusual decision.) It is a wood stick with a notch at every 2 gallon increment. So I dropped it down to the bottom of the tank to check the quantity. As the stick contacted the tank bottom, there was a distinct feeling that there was something else in the tank besides fuel. It felt like a layer of salt or sand... maybe a half inch deep laying in the bottom. Needless to say, I decided not to fly.

    Lon and Travis helped me figure out what to do. We decided to rig up a siphon tube and see if we could vacuum it out. It worked... and the results were almost unbelievable. We rigged the siphon tube with a rigid stick so it could be moved around along the bottom surfaces of the tank. After draining the entire 5 gallon contents out, we had caught three shop-towels full of these brown varnish flakes. It became obvious that this stuff was collecting around the finger strainer but was not passing through in normal operation. We poured in another 5 gallons of filtered avgas and repeated the process twice more and caught even more junk. These pictures show the results.

    I am so glad to have found this an corrected it before something bad happened. I recommend that everyone should check out their tanks especially if they have ever sat for a period of time with mogas. Don't assume the tank is clean just because you have a clean gascolator screen.
    Attached Files
    Terry Bowden, formerly TF # 351
    CERTIFIED AERONAUTICAL PRODUCTS, LLC
    Consultant D.E.R. Powerplant inst'l & Engines
    Vintage D.E.R. Structures, Electrical, & Mechanical Systems
    BC12D, s/n 7898, N95598
    weblog: Barnstmr's Random Aeronautics
    [email protected]

  • #2
    Re: N95598: Fuel Tank Surprising Discovery

    Oh yeah... once we finished, Lon and I went ahead and made the hour flight... including a stop and top-off at a nearby airport. It was a great flight... scud running and sneaking though between small rain showers... and finally got the airplane tucked away at Deer Pasture before the heavy rains set-in. We've had over 4 inches since then.... such a blessing for Central TX having had only a trace in the past 4 months.
    Terry Bowden, formerly TF # 351
    CERTIFIED AERONAUTICAL PRODUCTS, LLC
    Consultant D.E.R. Powerplant inst'l & Engines
    Vintage D.E.R. Structures, Electrical, & Mechanical Systems
    BC12D, s/n 7898, N95598
    weblog: Barnstmr's Random Aeronautics
    [email protected]

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: N95598: Fuel Tank Surprising Discovery

      Holy ___ ! (fill in favorite expletive)
      I had the same issue when my plane sat up for 6 months with mogas in it, but I did not think to ask you if you had been running mogas before the long hiatus. I even own a wooden dipstick. Maybe sounding the tank with the dipstick should become part of my annual inspections.

      So if 598 is back at Deer Pasture, where is Lon's plane?
      And when will we start his annual/have another Deer Pasture work day?
      Best Regards,
      Mark Julicher

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: N95598: Fuel Tank Surprising Discovery

        Mark,
        Not the greatest pic... here is a shot out our back door here at Tick Hill Airfield this week. Changed the bungees this week and some other tinkering on N95598. Yesterday we flew back to Deer Pasture Airfield.

        Lon got started on the engine 100 hour inspection on NC22207 this weekend. Oil changed and steam cleaned engine. Cleaning plugs next. Tomorrow I am helping him out to ground run and do compression check. We'll try to get the engine work done and signed off (100 hr) within the next week or so. Then ferry to Deer Pasture for the Annual work. We'll check the schedule how does Saturday after next sound?
        Attached Files
        Terry Bowden, formerly TF # 351
        CERTIFIED AERONAUTICAL PRODUCTS, LLC
        Consultant D.E.R. Powerplant inst'l & Engines
        Vintage D.E.R. Structures, Electrical, & Mechanical Systems
        BC12D, s/n 7898, N95598
        weblog: Barnstmr's Random Aeronautics
        [email protected]

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: N95598: Fuel Tank Surprising Discovery

          Mogas?? With 10%E or without E??
          Ray

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: N95598: Fuel Tank Surprising Discovery

            I have a BAD feeling he THOUGHT it was ethanol free. There are a LOT of stations claiming no alcohol that are actually contaminated with it. The alcohol draws water and damages seals, fails sealant and corrodes tanks. You HAVE TO test for alcohol if you use auto gas!
            Hank

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: N95598: Fuel Tank Surprising Discovery

              That looks more like the remains of an old float cork to me....which will desolve much faster in auto gas then in avgas for some reason...especially if the auto gas had ethonal in it....that shit will eat thru,gum up,and rot out just about anything.
              Kevin Mays
              West Liberty,Ky

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: N95598: Fuel Tank Surprising Discovery

                Another thing you better pay attention to is your flexible fuel lines! Mogas will kill most of that as well...you could have a bunch of crap in the bowl of the carb that you're not seeing either. Just a thought from past experience. One more reason I wont let that stuff in any airplane of mine.
                John
                I'm so far behind, I think I'm ahead

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: N95598: Fuel Tank Surprising Discovery

                  I will only use auto fuel that was taken directly from the pipeline PRIOR to adding anything to it (additives are put in at the terminal, the pipeline folks don't want that C**P in their line either) and pumped directly into the airports dedicated truck. Even THEN the airport tests every batch before they sell it to us.
                  When I get my plane back up I intend to test every can of fuel before I put it in the tank too. Not that much additional work for the increased peace of mind.
                  Hank

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: N95598: Fuel Tank Surprising Discovery

                    I have been using premium auto fuel for 20 years and now I use it without the ethynol and the bottom of my aluminum tank is still pretty and shiny. I know ethynol will do what it did to your system. I own/run an auto/marine repair business and you will see the same thing you have after anything more than 30 days with ethynhol fuel. I don't even leave 100LL in my Pitts for more than 60 days.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: N95598: Fuel Tank Surprising Discovery

                      Speaking of fuel tanks. I have never used my wing tanks. The controls, a handle above each door, are currently pointed to 12 0clock. Does that mean at 3 oclock they are open? Will it harm them to leave them empty? I do this for obvious weight reduction. Should I put some gas in each one? If so, how much? I have never used car gas since the Stearman (high test Amoco) in the 80's. Have heard too many night mares concerning car gas, especially when car gas is left too long in the tank. The T-Craft is cheap to run even at 5.75 a gallon! I add a touch of MMO also. JC
                      Last edited by jim cooper; 10-10-2011, 17:59.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: N95598: Fuel Tank Surprising Discovery

                        I have repeated this before, but for those who have not read this topic before.

                        Autofuel has a six month storage life in ideal conditions, (sealed metal container).

                        100LL has a year long storage life in ideal conditions.

                        Just throwing this out there since the topic is moving around a little.

                        (My wife works with the fuel industry).

                        PS: I have never had problems with MOGAS as long as it is ethanol-free and it is a good viable alternate source of fuel. However, I have seen first-hand the results of an all 100LL diet in these small Continentals. Remember the fuel requirement was originally 73 octane for these engines with a lot less lead.
                        Last edited by M Towsley; 10-10-2011, 18:45.
                        Cheers,
                        Marty


                        TF #596
                        1946 BC-12D N95258
                        Former owner of:
                        1946 BC-12D/N95275
                        1943 L-2B/N3113S

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: N95598: Fuel Tank Surprising Discovery

                          Marty has hit a nail square on the head! These small Continentals don't like a steady diet of 100LL Avgas. The 2.0 ML/gallon Tetraethyl lead is 4 times what the old 80 octane Avgas held. The flame temperature in these low-compression (designed for 73 octane gas) engines is inadequate to keep the tetraethyl lead in such quantities in suspension in the exhaust. The excess lead precipitates out of the burned fuel-air mix, and is deposited within the combustion chamber, leaving deposits which build up excessively on cylinder heads, piston tops, valve stems, valve seats and even ring grooves, and especially on spark plugs. High compression engines have a far higher flame temperature, and the burned lead stays in suspension and is scavenged from the combustion chamber with no ill effects.

                          Mogas worked just fine, within the limits of its storage characteristics, until the arrival of the ethanol blending, brought on us by over-zealous politicians in some sort of attempt to lessen our dependence on fossil fuels. The ethanol-blended Mogas fuel is the only kind available in some states, like my home state of Pennsylvania, due to government intervention. The Mogas with ethanol is outside the STC's available for standard-category airplanes.

                          So we have been left with a predicament. Ethanol-laced Mogas is the kiss of death for many types of engines, especially the two-strokes as used in many items like chain saws, leaf blowers, some lawnmowers and outboard motors. It has a way of separating out when it absorbs water, leaving no oil in the necessary oil-mixed gas. And many of the fuel lines and carburetor parts are seriously harmed or dissolved by the ethanol. In your small low-compression Continental (or other) airplane, IF all your fuel-line components are especially selected to resist the harmful effects of the ethanol-laced Mogas, it would work, within the octane and storage-life requirements, except for the reported harmful effects on aluminum gas tanks and fuel lines. I haven't personally seen the ethanol attacking aluminum, but many have commented on that phenomenon.

                          Some possible solutions? Avgas 92UL, which is 100 LL without the lead, would work fine, if and when it comes available. Good fresh Mogas, completely and verifiably without ethanol, if it can be obtained where you live, would be cheaper and would work well. I have written letters and signed petitions here in Pennsylvania protesting the government-mandated Ethanol blending, so far to no avail. Maybe more need to complain! Meanwhile I have used fuel additives, for example TCP, which is quite expensive and helps some. And though many will scoff, Marvel Mystery Oil, which is inexpensive, unapproved maybe, but with extensive experience over 30 years, works reasonably well.
                          Last edited by paulnuss; 10-11-2011, 13:35. Reason: spelling

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: N95598: Fuel Tank Surprising Discovery

                            Originally posted by barnstmr View Post
                            ...we recently thoroughly cleaned and flushed out the fuel tank during annual inspection. Since the annual, I have flown exclusively with avgas for around 8 hours with no hint of a fuel contamination problem...
                            Just out of curiosity, in light of the above, why do you blame Mogas?

                            Any chance what you found was, as someone else suggested, the remains of an old float, or the shellac coating, or maybe sloshing compound?
                            John
                            New Yoke hub covers
                            www.skyportservices.net

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: N95598: Fuel Tank Surprising Discovery

                              I once had a tank of non-ethanol mogas sit in my tank for long term storage. The fuel either evaporated or dripped out over the course of a 18 months. When I refurbished the plane, I got large flakes of varnish (1.5 inches in diameter) out of that tank. My cork float was not deteriorated.
                              The plane flew fine on mogas, but the varnish was incredible. I used a slosh of carb cleaner to clean the tank before I reinstalled it.
                              Best Regards,
                              Mark Julicher

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X