What's an Experimental?

[jartz]

I have seen references to "experimental" Taylorcrafts. I know that means they no longer meet the requirements of the standard category, and I originally thought that it meant an experimental amateur build. In fact, I looked at a clipped wing Taylorcraft last year whch had been modified to an aerobatic single-seater; it was a very sweet plane, and it had a plate which said that it was an experimental amateur build. But then I read somewhere else that a certified airplane cannot simply be modified to become an experimental AB, but rather would be an experimental exhibition, or air-racing, or research and development, or the like, which would seem to dramatically restrict its permitted use.

Can someone clarify this for me? If one acquires a "project" and does not return it to standard category, into what category does it fall?

Thanks,
John

[pete]

Re: What's an Experimental?

That’s pretty much right, John. To meet the requirements of the amateur built category, the builder must meet the 51-percent rule. That makes it the major portion, not “modified”. Your project can fall under any of the experimental categories if you meet those requirements.
Pete

[resojames]

Re: What's an Experimental?

The clip wing conversion conversion has been considered to be enough modification required to allow amateur experimental licensing in the past. However, there has been some reluctance by some FISDOs to issure the amateur catagory. I have done them both as amateur and exibition. Obviously, the resale is less with the exibition rating as it much more restrictive. However, I was only using my plane for airshows and it was not that important to me.

[Forrest Barber]

Re: What's an Experimental?

There are 5 Experimential: homebuilt, exhibition, research & development, marketing, and when a major change is made and it needs flight tested, like Dave Wileys ship..... might be more.

[Garry Crookham]

Re: What's an Experimental?

Ther are actually 9 different experimental categories:

§ 21.191 Experimental certificates.

Experimental certificates are issued for the following purposes:

(a) Research and development. Testing new aircraft design concepts, new aircraft equipment, new aircraft installations, new aircraft operating techniques, or new uses for aircraft.

(b) Showing compliance with regulations. Conducting flight tests and other operations to show compliance with the airworthiness regulations including flights to show compliance for issuance of type and supplemental type certificates, flights to substantiate major design changes, and flights to show compliance with the function and reliability requirements of the regulations.

(c) Crew training. Training of the applicant's flight crews.

(d) Exhibition. Exhibiting the aircraft's flight capabilities, performance, or unusual characteristics at air shows, motion picture, television, and similar productions, and the maintenance of exhibition flight proficiency, including (for persons exhibiting aircraft) flying to and from such air shows and productions.

(e) Air racing. Participating in air races, including (for such participants) practicing for such air races and flying to and from racing events.

(f) Market surveys. Use of aircraft for purposes of conducting market surveys, sales demonstrations, and customer crew training only as provided in §21.195.

(g) Operating amateur-built aircraft. Operating an aircraft the major portion of which has been fabricated and assembled by persons who undertook the construction project solely for their own education or recreation.

(h) Operating primary kit-built aircraft. Operating a primary category aircraft that meets the criteria of §21.24(a)(1) that was assembled by a person from a kit manufactured by the holder of a production certificate for that kit, without the supervision and quality control of the production certificate holder under §21.184(a).

(i) Operating light-sport aircraft. Operating a light-sport aircraft that—

(1) Has not been issued a U.S. or foreign airworthiness certificate and does not meet the provisions of §103.1 of this chapter. An experimental certificate will not be issued under this paragraph for these aircraft after January 31, 2008;

(2) Has been assembled—

(i) From an aircraft kit for which the applicant can provide the information required by §21.193(e); and

(ii) In accordance with manufacturer's assembly instructions that meet an applicable consensus standard; or

(3) Has been previously issued a special airworthiness certificate in the light-sport category under §21.190.

[Amdt. 21–21, 38 FR 6858, May 7, 1968, as amended by Amdt. 21–57, 49 FR 39651, Oct. 9, 1984; Amdt. 21–70, 57 FR 41369, Sept. 9, 1992; Amdt. 21–85, 69 FR 44862, July 27, 2004; Amdt. 21–85, 69 FR 53336, Sept. 1, 2004]




In the past the FAA has been quite broad on it's interpretation of "Amateur Built", but has recently started to enforce the 51% rule and has stated that a standard category airplane canot be placed in the experimental, amateur built category.

At the present time we have an individual here in Tulsa trying to obtain an amateur built experimental certificate for an aircraft he has modified from a high performance multi-engine standard category aircraft to a single engine turboprop. The battle has gone to the top, the FAA HQ in D.C. is now involved.

Garry Crookham
N5112M
Tulsa

[Ragwing nut]

Re: What's an Experimental?

Ther are actually 9 different experimental categories:

§ 21.191 Experimental certificates.

Experimental certificates are issued for the following purposes:

(a) Research and development. Testing new aircraft design concepts, new aircraft equipment, new aircraft installations, new aircraft operating techniques, or new uses for aircraft.

(b) Showing compliance with regulations. Conducting flight tests and other operations to show compliance with the airworthiness regulations including flights to show compliance for issuance of type and supplemental type certificates, flights to substantiate major design changes, and flights to show compliance with the function and reliability requirements of the regulations.

(c) Crew training. Training of the applicant's flight crews.

(d) Exhibition. Exhibiting the aircraft's flight capabilities, performance, or unusual characteristics at air shows, motion picture, television, and similar productions, and the maintenance of exhibition flight proficiency, including (for persons exhibiting aircraft) flying to and from such air shows and productions.

(e) Air racing. Participating in air races, including (for such participants) practicing for such air races and flying to and from racing events.

(f) Market surveys. Use of aircraft for purposes of conducting market surveys, sales demonstrations, and customer crew training only as provided in §21.195.

(g) Operating amateur-built aircraft. Operating an aircraft the major portion of which has been fabricated and assembled by persons who undertook the construction project solely for their own education or recreation.

(h) Operating primary kit-built aircraft. Operating a primary category aircraft that meets the criteria of §21.24(a)(1) that was assembled by a person from a kit manufactured by the holder of a production certificate for that kit, without the supervision and quality control of the production certificate holder under §21.184(a).

(i) Operating light-sport aircraft. Operating a light-sport aircraft that—

(1) Has not been issued a U.S. or foreign airworthiness certificate and does not meet the provisions of §103.1 of this chapter. An experimental certificate will not be issued under this paragraph for these aircraft after January 31, 2008;

(2) Has been assembled—

(i) From an aircraft kit for which the applicant can provide the information required by §21.193(e); and

(ii) In accordance with manufacturer's assembly instructions that meet an applicable consensus standard; or

(3) Has been previously issued a special airworthiness certificate in the light-sport category under §21.190.

[Amdt. 21–21, 38 FR 6858, May 7, 1968, as amended by Amdt. 21–57, 49 FR 39651, Oct. 9, 1984; Amdt. 21–70, 57 FR 41369, Sept. 9, 1992; Amdt. 21–85, 69 FR 44862, July 27, 2004; Amdt. 21–85, 69 FR 53336, Sept. 1, 2004]




In the past the FAA has been quite broad on it's interpretation of "Amateur Built", but has recently started to enforce the 51% rule and has stated that a standard category airplane canot be placed in the experimental, amateur built category.

At the present time we have an individual here in Tulsa trying to obtain an amateur built experimental certificate for an aircraft he has modified from a high performance multi-engine standard category aircraft to a single engine turboprop. The battle has gone to the top, the FAA HQ in D.C. is now involved.

Garry Crookham
N5112M
Tulsa

"Their" interpretation pisses me off in that how would they know the difference between a real J-3 cub being passed off as a wag-aero cuby and someone actually building from scratch. Then again, what would be the difference of buying a fully welded cuby fuselage and using a real J-3 cub fuselage. Just rebuilding a stock airplane requires more hours than it for the factory to build from scratch which would easily meet the 51% rule in labor. I think I would go postal on some of the idiots in FSDO if I knew I could get away with it.

[jartz]

Re: What's an Experimental?

It's this part of what Garry said which concerns me: "recently started to enforce the 51% rule and has stated that a standard category airplane canot be placed in the experimental, amateur built category."

I understand Ragwing Nut's point of view, and probably agree with it, but if I were to try to go that route and got the plane finished, I wouldn't want to have the FAA say "no." I may not like how they apply the rules, but they are the ones who can say "yes" or "no," and while one could fight it, I'd rather fly than litigate.

Thanks to all for your helpful and insightful comments.

John

[Forrest Barber]

Re: What's an Experimental?

The problem is with the aircraft when it is sold and the next owner does not have a "clue" as to what he has or how to maintain it.
"Continued Airworthiness" is the concern.
" IN THE BEGINNING" the idea of an "Experimental Homebuilt" was to promote a builder to build his own aircraft, that means HE builds it, tests it flys it and does not sell it!! Back then the airworthiness ceased when sold and it had to ahve a new "condition inspection" by the new owner...
YES I know there are fine folks out there trying to comply with the regs and keep excellent airplanes flying; HOWEVER there are hammer mechanics out there who should never be allowed to sell their poorly built or modified aircraft to the unsuspecting new purchaser. IMHO