should harnesses

[robbie]

Old subject,have looked at previous thread and have a few questions.
1 I see some of the guys have used Hooker harness, which attachés to the center of the cross tube, do we think with two people, the tube is strong enough?
2. Has any one used the harnesses from Wag-Aero,they are cheaper?
3. Has any one used just one belt like Cessna's uses, and if so where do you find them?

[jim cooper]

Re: should harnesses

I had shoulder harnesses in my 7BCM Aeronca. I witnessed a bad accident 3 years ago. The instructor died. I am convinced that neither would have been badly injured IF they had had shoulder restraint. Mine were NOT hookers, but well made canvas. I think they are well worth the time and money regardless of brand if they are approved. JC

[waltermrich]

Re: should harnesses

Last summer in Oshkosh I attented an Faa seminar on aircraft saftey, the topic of sholder harneses came up and the speaker stressed that the Faa did not care so much the tecnicalities about them but that they be installed in your airplane.They are concernd about surviveablity.

[NY86]

Re: should harnesses

Agreed. Any shoulder harness is better than none. (Almost...) It doesn't take much energy to kill or lobotimize you if your head hits the panel.

[N74DV]

Re: should harnesses

We put the Hooker harnesses in our T last February. I felt so naked before that flying around with only a lap belt. Wouldn't take much of a hit to bring your forehead straight to the panel with not so good results.

The Hookers are a 4 point type that connect from both shoulders to the lap belt. I cinch mine down good and snug every flight and I feel very safe.

It's a MUST, even if you use some old Chevy shoulder belts rigged to the cross tube. Approved? who cares... I don't think smashing your cranium against the dash is approved either.

[Carl E. Carson]

Re: should harnesses

I installed mine during the recent restoration. I bought mine from A/C Spruce and feel much confident about flying with them. Any type/style is better than just a lap belt.

Carl

[Larry Lyons]

Re: should harnesses

Around here the T-Craft is noted for killing because of the long control tube crushing the chest. A shoulder restraint won't eliminate that but it will minimize it.
Larry

[Ragwing nut]

Re: should harnesses

Seat belts are now just a log book entry with approved belts. The funny thing is aircraft belts are rated at 1500lbs where auto belts are rated to 2500lbs. I use only Hooker and have never had a problem

[Robert Bradbury]

Re: should harnesses

Seat belts are now just a log book entry with approved belts. The funny thing is aircraft belts are rated at 1500lbs where auto belts are rated to 2500lbs. I use only Hooker and have never had a problem

I read an account of an accident in the mid 90's when a small tandum seat
aircraft lost the engine and the pilot/father had to ditch the plane in an open field where there was lots of snow and he was wheels only. Ayway, the father
wearing lap belt only was knocked unconsious . The 10 year old son who was in the back got out and walker around until he froze to death, his father died from the cold as well.

Another friend of mine who is a commercial pilot with some 25,000 plus hours
told me a story one day. He was flying his Super Cub solo on a perfect clear calm sunny day and the next thing he was struggling to consciousness . He could hardly see because of the blood that was pouring over his face . Apparantly he hit some kind of microburst that slammed him into the tubing on the
roof and was cut open rather severely across the top of his head . He was not wearing a seatbelt of any kind, now all he wears are four point harnesses.

For this reason I installed a four point in my aircraft and I wear a helmet. O.K., so I look a little too Tecno for the T but once you get use to it the helmets are great. I installed noise cancelation with gel ear seals which are
very comfy . Also with the push of a button I can slide down a graduated
sun visor to the desired level of protection. The harness was easy to get use to . I put them on during taxie on the water after all of the checks are complete.

[Larry Lyons]

Re: should harnesses

For this reason I installed a four point in my aircraft and I wear a helmet. O.K., so I look a little too Tecno for the T but once you get use to it the helmets are great. I installed noise cancelation with gel ear seals which are
very comfy . Also with the push of a button I can slide down a graduated
sun visor to the desired level of protection. The harness was easy to get use to . I put them on during taxie on the water after all of the checks are complete.

I concur, I like the feeling of a good restraint system. In my opinion it makes me one with the vehicle, what ever it may be.
Larry

[flyguy]

Re: should harnesses

I've read/heard several reports of guys being knocked silly and bleeding from turbulence, one of them in a large fancy aircraft.

As my head is almost against the diagonal tube overhead I have actually looked at cycling helmets and such wondering how to adapt one for use with headphones.
Haven't gone any further than thinking about it, though. As I have said before my shoulder harness is rigged perfect for turbulence, but would likely injure my back in a heavy forward crash.
Darryl

Edit: anyone have a crotch strap in your B12? Any comments on how you tied it down?

[Robert Bradbury]

Re: should harnesses

I've read/heard several reports of guys being knocked silly and bleeding from turbulence, one of them in a large fancy aircraft.

As my head is almost against the diagonal tube overhead I have actually looked at cycling helmets and such wondering how to adapt one for use with headphones.
Haven't gone any further than thinking about it, though. As I have said before my shoulder harness is rigged perfect for turbulence, but would likely injure my back in a heavy forward crash.
Darryl

Edit: anyone have a crotch strap in your B12? Any comments on how you tied it down?

Same here .With the seat sling at the lowest point my head is almost on the tubing. I could never have kept the original headliner, so I cut it out and I
installed a skylight. With the helmet on I have hit the tubing quite hard on
several occasions so I'm happy enough to keep wearing it .

[jim cooper]

Re: should harnesses

I agree with everyone who says the harness is worth the time and money. I'm 72 and have flown since 1954. Most of that time, 2900 hours was in taildraggers. Most of the aircraft did not have shoulder harnesses, with the exception of the Stearman. However, a helmet is not on my to do list. Maybe if I was in an Ag-Cat or another sprayer, or in combat but not in a BD12D. Thats a tad much I think but then its up to the individual. My harness came down from above on each side, two more came up from the seat thru the crotch, then with the seat belt it all hitched with a quick disconnect at the stomach. Very secure and felt good in a radical slip or loop. JC

[akndrifter]

Re: should harnesses

I don't think a helmet is too much at all. Especially in Alaska. All it takes are a few bumps to put your head into the tubes above you. I don't even want to know what could happen if I went on my back some how. Also, that dash is pretty dang close, the harness helps with that one. But I'm still not sure it would be out to reach of my forehead in rapid deceleration. I'd probably never say I wished I didn't have a helmet.

[Guest]

Re: should harnesses

Old subject,have looked at previous thread and have a few questions.
1 I see some of the guys have used Hooker harness, which attachés to the center of the cross tube, do we think with two people, the tube is strong enough?
2. Has any one used the harnesses from Wag-Aero,they are cheaper?
3. Has any one used just one belt like Cessna's uses, and if so where do you find them?

I use the single harness that goes across the shoulder. The new Taylorctrafts used that too in the 80's and maybe 90's.

I purchased my belts and some hardware new from the factory back in '87 and also got some of the hardware parts from a wrecked f20 or f19.

Go purchase a new set from the factory but pay with a credit card or COD.