Any news from the factory?

[RobertP]

Hi Forrest,

Any news from the factory? with the current economic state I would be supprised if anyone would want to take up producing LSA? any chance that they will hand the type certificates back to the FAA or dosn't that sort of thing happen?

[VictorBravo]

Re: Any news from the factory?

You're right, the economic situation would not support new T-craft LSA's.

Matter of fact, about the only thing they could do to survive would be to produce replacement and repair parts for the existing fleet.

Hey, wait a minute... producing parts for existing airplanes... because of the current US economic situation?

Hot Damn... there IS a silver lining...Quick...somebody find me an Obama bumper sticker!

[flyguy]

Re: Any news from the factory?

It would be great if some business (not a con artist) would start buying up old Taylorcraft airframes and useable parts and start restoring them as very lightweight LSA's. Gotta be cheaper than building a new aircraft from scratch. Cut some kind of deal with the certificate holder on parts manufacturing until they could buy it. Then I could hope for a certified clip-wing someday.
There I go dreaming again.
DC

[jartz]

Re: Certified Clip Wing

Oooooh, a certified clip wing! You're my hero!

John

[crispy critter]

Re: Certified Clip Wing

Oooooh, a certified clip wing! You're my hero!

John

........that would also be light sport legal.

[Garry Crookham]

Re: Any news from the factory?

Speaking of parts from the factory...I ordered a couple of small pulleys for the elevator trim asm last week...the factory answered the phone on the first ring, had the pulleys in stock, took my credit card number, and two days later I had them in my hands. I was pleasantly surprised!

Garry Crookham
N5112M
Tulsa

[N74DV]

Re: Any news from the factory?

while you were pleasantly surprised I'm still thoroughly disgusted.

I called about 9 months ago regarding some wing strut attach fittings. I asked if there were drawings available (even for purchase) so that we could figure a solution to some corrosion we found in our fittings. After I had to explain to the answerer of the phone that I was talking about the fitting from the recent AD (I got the impression the guy knew nothing of the AD) I was told "yeah we can get that to you". 8 months later and even a few more phone calls yielded nothing.

In fact I'm still waiting for those drawings.... but it's pointless now. We figured it out ourselves and moved on.

And don't even ask me about the other times I called a while back (when Harry was the king) about a new fuel tank that was ordered and to this day never did get.

like almost anything with the old Tcraft... if you want it done (at all) then you gotta do it yourself.

As far as I'm concerned the factory can go screw itself.

[RobertP]

Re: Any news from the factory?

The spares issue could be very valid as in the UK the used car market is doing well and likewise garages with everybody keeping their old bangers going instead of buying new cars or buying secondhand! I would have thought anyone with some business acronym could have got the Taylorcraft spares issue sorted and then take it from there once things pick up again having got the factory established once more, seems the way to go to me? Got me thinking about things when I was running around like a headless chicken last week trying to get my exhaust stack repaired. The current situation for spares for the more modern Taylorcraft seems very poor, probably worse than for the older models I guess.

I got the impresion in a post I saw from Forrest just before Christmas that there was a possibility that something may be happening unless I got it wrong of course!

[VictorBravo]

Re: Any news from the factory?

I would have thought anyone with some business acronym could have got the Taylorcraft spares issue sorted

Well, yes, there is an appropriate business acronym... it dates back to the second World War... FUBAR

Sorry Robert, I just couldn't pass that one up

They don't have much acumen either, unfortunately, or they would have become participants in this discussion and had something to say for themselves, even occasionally.

[RobertP]

Re: Any news from the factory?

Bill,

I guess it shows that as a kid I spent to much time watching aeroplanes instead of being in school!! but non the less it would be nice to know exactly what is happening as the silence is deafening!

[Robert Bradbury]

Re: Any news from the factory?

Imagine, so many people out of work, so many of us needing parts and there's
a business that cannot make it . What happened to the old economic formula
of supply and demand? Problem here in North America is that we cannot afford our own products because we make too much money. How many things
you buy on a daily basis has made in America on it? If it's not comming from China, India, Mexico etc. then we can't afford it. When an auto worker is making $70 an hour and Electricans $130,000 a year and this is working two weeks on two off. My Brother make $100 per hour working overtime that is. He's a Carpenter. Edo as I understand is having the 1320 made in China so we
can afford to buy them, if we make them here they're too expensive . Until
some adjustments are made, and I don't mean BIG, things are only going to
continue in this direction.

[ClipWing_T]

Re: Any news from the factory?

I live in Sulphur Springs, Tx where the Legend Cub is built. When
Legend first started talking about build the Cub replica they wanted
to try and get a base model availiable for sell @ $59,999.00 . Soon
the price became $ 69,999.00 and they went up from there with
many selling at $100K plus and have produced approx. 150 planes.
At one time there was 40 employee's or so and last week there was
three people out there. It seems that all the rich guy's got their Cub
relica that wanted one and now the market is saturated and plus the
economy too. Legend was slowing down well BEFORE the current economic
problems we have in the U.S. now. Legend actually considered trying
to contact the Taylorcraft owners and maybe try producing the T-Craft.
At least that was what was mentioned around the airport. That was
when they were knee deep in orders for the Cub and was looking to
get bigger. They also talked about drawing up a Aeronca clone too.
But the orders started dying and as with all light airplane companies,
the old black cloud came rolling in and no new sales . Also in house
problems didn't help either. (too many chiefs and not enough warriors,
Is that too un-PC to say ?) . I had hoped that Legend could buy the
Taylorcraft Co. and produce a few planes and LOTS of parts ! I will
piss off a lot of people by saying this....but the T-Craft is not a
very marketable airplane IMO . If it were , I think there would have
been dozens produced by now. True.....Harry messed it up bad for
anyone wanting to continue the line. I love Taylorcrafts and I am like
everyone else here..i want to see MORE T-Crafts . But now with the
economic woes and PLENTY of LSA airplanes to choose from ,plus the
modern pilots not wanting a taildragger and fabric.......I see the a dark
future for Taylorcraft airplanes ever being built again. Maybe , someone
can get the jigs and tooling and produce parts by the truck loads
Supply and demand should come into play .....and maybe that is the
problem too? Just my opinion of course.
Mike

[Robert Bradbury]

Re: Any news from the factory?

You may be right on the marketability of the Tcraft . I can get a good
used 172 on floats with 180 hp for $75K. Why would I pay 80-100 for
a fabric aircraft that is not as capable ? Other than burning more fuel
I'd say the fabric requires a lot more TLC to keep it out in the elements.

[VictorBravo]

Re: Any news from the factory?

You cannot properly compare a used 172 to a new T-craft. Same way you can buy a $500 used car but there is still a market for $25K new cars.

Harley-Davidson builds an atrociously loud, inefficient, not-sleek, low tech motorcycle that is far more expensive than a lot of technically better motorcycles. But they seem to sell pretty well.

THAT's how Taylorcraft needs to be marketed and produced, if at all.

The first step toward creating such a market is the same way H-D got popular again after all those years... there were tens of thousands of OLD used Harleys on the road winning over the public and making their characteristic silly noise. So making the parts to get another 500 T-craft projects out of garages and into the air would be a part of it.

H-D bikes always carried a bad-boy image because of the biker gangs from the 1960's. Those gangs were truly bad people in many cases, and should not be glorified... but the American public did glorify them (with the help of H-D's marketing people, I'm sure).

The "biker" image was changed from a drunken, smelly, bar brawler to an American rebel with a good heart and only a mild distatse for the establishment. When that happened, all of a sudden it was cool to be a Harley-riding semi-biker on the weekend, after you left your accounting job on Friday.

Now kiddies, do you really think that image change happened by accident?

If Taylorcrafts are ever to be mass produced and sold at a profit, that same thing would have to happen here. The mental image of the T-craft requiring a bit more skill to fly has to be amplified into the T-craft requiring a very skilled pilot. The T-craft has to become something that only the elite can handle... only the bad-ass pilots with the biggest balls need apply. Rebels with dirt under their fingernails, questionable past lives flying for Air America in Asia, and logbooks filled with adventure! When I was your age, kid, we had to find our mission target with a compass, then we'd drink the whiskey out of the compass on the way home to kill the pain from the shrapnel!

Whether that kind of a marketing coup is possible, or advisable, I'll leave to others to explore. Taylorcraft as a company would have to create a long-term plan, have the money, and beat out other bad-ass airplanes like Luscombes and Monocoupes to become the H-D of airplanes.

If the T-craft got an image makeover like the Harley did, I guess that would make all of US the equivalent of the 1960's bikers, the "original gangsters" or "old school" Hell's Angels.

Hey what's that smell? Never mind, it's me... What you lookin at, mother***** ?

[Ragwing nut]

Re: Any news from the factory?

We were a dealer for Taylorcraft in the late 80's early 90's when they were still in Lock Haven. We told them then to forget about building airplanes and build parts. The market could not support it then, and sure can't support it now. Told Harry the same thing. Why do you think Univair, Wag-Aero, Dakota Cub, and others have lasted so long?

The new proposed regs for light sport that if they become law, may help LSA in a huge way if manufacturers would get SMART and offer kits to considerably reduce the purchase price by eliminating much of the labor to build them.