Harry's STILL at the factory

[Forrest Barber]

Re: Harry's STILL at the factory

That phrasing was composed by our very own web master and approved by the Board. I too want to try to rectify the situation of our members and non-members sending money into a company that does not honor their commitments. I am checking with the Board about the situation.
I encourage any member who was in his opinion 'cheated" out of money to start a thread that reflects an honest attempt to find out out the names of people, the amount of money, and what was ordered. This will serve to see how much was involved, when , and to what "company" .
The present folks answering the phones at Taylorcraft in Brownsville say they have the list; maybe we could compare it?
Have at it, I have to fly again, oh poor me, the sun is out for once this past four days... We are very lucky compared to others, I hope no friends of ours or Tribe members got hurt in the massive tornado situation these past few days. I will call the factory and the FAA alter today or first thing in the morning for the latest.

[DanBrown]

Re: Harry's STILL at the factory

Forrest,

Is the Taylorcraft Foundation Board willing to have the letter that has been drafted on this thread come from the foundation? (originally by Bill Berle http://vb.taylorcraft.org/attachment...6&d=1208456100 and then suggestions by several others.

IMHO, I think it will help both the owners and the foundation to send it out.

What do you think of the idea to have a session at the July fly-in to finish the mailing to all owners?

I'm planning to fly out early that week to help with anything that needs getting ready for the fly-in.

[Forrest Barber]

Re: Harry's STILL at the factory

I have read and copied the letter, I see no problem with sending it out to all owners, congressmen and any one interested. I do think that MORE owners should be on the discussion group, I have a least three calls a week that are basically " Hi, I just bought a Taylorcraft and need to know about ?????? then I ask if they belong to the Foundation, No ; do they read the fourm : No , do they have a Mechanic that knows Taylorcrafts ; No ; then I explain how to get this already published information.
Just this morning I had a conversation with a new owner on brakes; his IA & he will now be able to search and get all off the internet.... He thinks he might join the Foundation.
NOW , we need to know WHO this "group of owners" may be ; Bill , and others respond to this question as to how to floow up on the ones that agree with the letter. I will present to the Board, I may re print this letter for our, next newsletter, the Taylorcrafter. It is a well drafted letter and this is the first I have seen it!
thank you Dan for your thoughts , yes lets get together prior to the Fly-In....

[VictorBravo]

Re: Harry's STILL at the factory

IT seems to me that two important purposes can be served by sending out a letter like that.

First, the Foundation and the members of this internet group can put out a warning, which may prevent a lot of people from getting ripped off.

Second, the Foundation will be attracting many new potential members.

If there are T-craft owners who are not aware of the existence of the Foundation and this discussion group, it is merely a lack of advertising or promotion, or a lack of getting the word out by the Foundation. That is a separate issue than the Harry problem, but it sure seems that both the Harry problem and the Foundation membership concern would both be addressed.

I'll gladly change my version of this letter to serve the second purpose a little more. I'm fairly sure that input and suggested changes from all other interested parties would be 100% welcome too.

[VictorBravo]

Re: Harry's STILL at the factory

Here's my updated version

[DanBrown]

Re: Harry's STILL at the factory

Bill,

That is a very fine letter Now would someone take the lead to collect money for printing, folding and stapelling 3800 copies (of 2 double sided pages) plus getting the postage. I'm ready to print the labels. Then we can meet in Alliance in July to put on the labels and postage and send it out.

[VictorBravo]

Re: Harry's STILL at the factory

The document I attached to the last post could be printed a bit more cost-effectively on one sheet of 11x17 paper and folded in a folding machine. This would reduce the number of stapling operations.

I say again that it might be a lot cheaper and more efficient to have a mass mailing company do this instead of waiting to get 20 club members to sit together for an entire weekend licking stamps and banging on staplers.

The Foundation might consider paying for this as a combination of a community service and a membership drive.

Bill

[Carl E. Carson]

Re: Harry's STILL at the factory

Hello all: It is interesting that I just received a mailing from the factory announcing "New Owners" and "New Management" and signed by Harvey Patrick. It is a nice promo, a full color 5" X 8" card, now if they just had the products and integrity to do what they are promoting.

Carl

[VictorBravo]

Re: Harry's STILL at the factory

Guys... by sending out a greeting card like that, the Taylorcraft "factory" is doing exactly what I suggested we should be doing. They probably read what we have been talking about, and they made a pre-emptive strike. Now thousands of T-craft owners are being influenced that all is well in Brownsville.

The fact that they spent their money on marketing for new victims instead of making parts and fulfilling any orders is the very last nail in the coffin.

I've done my part... I came up with an idea, put the idea out for discussion, found two or three resources who could do the mailing faster and cheaper than we could do it ourselves, and then created two versions of the actual document to send. That's my part, I'm glad to have been able to put my time and effort where my mouth is.

Now it's your turn, fine citizens of Taylorcraftville, get off your ass and follow through:

1) Forget about peeling labels and licking stamps. It's a nice idea but it is fraught with opportunities to slow this project down when it needs to speed up.
2) Pick one of the mass mailing companies and get a hard quote based on the document I put up last night.
3) Somebody buy a Taylorcraft mailing list that can be used as an electronic file so the mailing company can simply imprint the address along with printing the documents.
4) Pass the hat online through this website and word of mouth.
5) Someone step up to collect the "pass the hat" money and keep track of it, and take responsibility to send the money to the mailing company.
6) The Foundation should be be given the opportunity to contribute 50% of the cost of this project, in return for having this letter "come from" the Foundation and "market" membership in the Foundation with this letter... a valid investment towards increasing the number of paid Foundation members.
7) If the Foundation chooses not to put in the "matching funds", then the letter gets reformatted to reflect simply a warning from a large group of concerned private owners. The Foundation can then pay 100% of the cost (to reach the same number of people for membership appeal) in the future, instead of 50% today.
8) The person who collected the money pulls the trigger and the mailing company sends out the !(#*% letter and the project is completed.

I'm sorry to rattle anyone's cage here, but this is clearly the time when the discussion, arm waving, and saber rattling needs to stop and this effort must now morph into physical action. All we need is two or three people to put in a SMALL amount of time to do the parts I listed above, and the rest of us to just send a check or click Paypal or something. This is something that should be able to go out in 45 days or less.

[DanBrown]

Re: Harry's STILL at the factory

I'm happy to go along with Bill's plan. I will contribute to either the Foundation or send a check to whoever wants to take the ball from here. I can also supply a mail list as an Excel spreadsheet.

[Aircraftman1]

Re: Harry's STILL at the factory

Where/who do we send money to for this? Im ready to contribute! Bob the interior man

[Aircraftman1]

Re: Harry's STILL at the factory

"I'm sorry to rattle anyone's cage here, but this is clearly the time when the discussion, arm waving, and saber rattling needs to stop and this effort must now morph into physical action. All we need is two or three people to put in a SMALL amount of time to do the parts I listed above, and the rest of us to just send a check or click Paypal or something. This is something that should be able to go out in 45 days or less."

I couldnt agree more!... its getting awefully quiet in here again!... Someone just let me know what I can do to help get this ball rolling!,
Bob the interior man...

[VictorBravo]

Re: Harry's STILL at the factory

Bob the Interior Man,

You can help by being the hub of the wheel that makes this work with just a little bit of your time and effort.

1. Contact one of the bulk mail places that I found and posted. Send them one of the letters I wrote as a sample, and tell them you want to send it to about 3000 people. (I will create a final-final version when appropriate)

2. Thanks to a post by Dan Brown I believe, you can tell the mailing company that you will furnish them with an electronic mail list.

3. Get a hard quote from them to print the letters on one 11x 17 page folded twice... tell them the letter will be formatted with an open area for postage and address. Make sure their quote includes printing, imprinting the address, folding, stapling or other closure of their choice, and mailing them out.

4. Post on this forum what the different prices are. Once you do that either I or someone else will advise on what is the next step.

Forrest and Foundation board, I'm not trying to piss off anyone by forcing the issue here but it appears that you guys will have to take a stand. For the life of me I can't see any risk or problem with the Foundation taking a stand on an issue that is this clear cut and appropriate to do so. If I missed something or there's some back-room maneuvering that is not known to me, I'm all ears.

The final version of this warning letter can include a solicitation for membership in the Foundation, if the Foundation chooses to put up the matching funds to equal what the individual members pony up. This will save the Foundation money versus sending out a membership solicitation as a separate mailing.

We need one or two additional volunteers besides Bob and I to make a difference here... IMHO:

1. We need a stand-up kinda guy with financial experience and who has established some credibility here to collect the funds (checks, Paypal, etc.) and keep track of the dollars. And to eventually write the check to the mailing company

2. We need someone who will solicit and collect the stories and experiences of people who were ripped off or lied to by Harry and company... and put these stories into some sort of an archive document. This doesn't mean flying to Khatmandu and interviewing people, it just means searching this forum archive and communicating with the people with stories by e-mail.

3. We need a very small bit of time by an attorney (I know there's one or two here) to look at the letter and make sure that no gross legal lines are crossed. We don't need a complete "Fortune 500 size company" risk management analysis and a legal defense fortress, we just need to know that what we're sending out is factual enough to be a basically sound "truth" defense. The way I wrote the warning letter will help this greatly (feverish sound of patting myself on the back), because it does not make any direct claims of specific detail fact... it represents the personal and collective opinions of a group of people.

Many of us are well aware of the rich, checkered, unsinkable, and gutsy history of Taylorcraft, the little airplane that would not stay down. Here is your chance to be a part of that history, right a great wrong, and open up a can of whoop-ass on a very deserving pair of rodents. When you're 125 years old and sitting in the corner of a hangar telling young pilots the stories about aviation, you can say you had played a part in something worthwhile.

[VictorBravo]

Re: Harry's STILL at the factory

GOOD NEWS !

It turns out that bulk mailing is a little less expensive than some previous estimates. It looks like this could come in at less than $1500 all-inclusive for 3000 mailings. That's only $750 from the Foundation and $750 from passing the hat.

For $750 the Foundation can easily pick up 100 new members (at $15 dues each), essentially doubling its investment.

For us as individuals it's a very small contribution to make for reasonably effective rat poison.

By the way, it wouldn't surprise me at all if the recent postcard from Heckle and Jeckle is to get as many orders for (probably imaginary) parts before the letter WE send out, because they know that what when we do it, it'll be the last nail in the coffin.

[Hank Jarrett]

Re: Harry's STILL at the factory

Like many here, checkbook is in hand. Say when, how much and where to send it. We may be quiet but there are a BUNCH of us just waiting to pitch in to the kitty. Wish we could do more than just make a contribution of money but you do what you can when you can.
Hank