My hydraulic heel brake system mock up

[jgerard]

I have rounded up the parts to build a "BOLT ON" hydraulic brake conversion for my F19. It maintains the factory heel brake pedals, no need to modify the airframe at all. I am replacing the cable operated Cleveland drum brakes with Cleveland 6" wheels and single puck disc brakes. The F19 already has 1.5" axles and the caliper carrier plate bolts right on. I am sending a few pics off to my FAA rep for evaluation before moving on with the conversion. The main reason for this conversion is to get the plane stopped in less than 200' over and over and over again safely and reliably. I have been unsuccessful in getting the mechanical Cleveland's to perform as nice as my old Shinn brakes. 200' or less landing rollouts are possible, but I must constantly adjust the brakes and I am worried about the extra stress I put on the system every time I stomp those tiny heel brakes through the floor. The old Cleveland brakes are in my opinion not meant to be used that hard continuously. I have seen broken backing plates, warped drums and they will devour a set of the overly prices shoes quickly. I would rather convert to hyd disc brakes and sell my cable brakes while they are still in good condition to someone that needs them. Lots of Luscombes and Champs with the same set up.

[wlas]

Re: My hydraulic heel brake system mock up

That looks like it will work, I've used those master cylinders on champs and they work real good. Single puck clevelands will work way better than the cable brakes. I mounted my master cylinders under the floor, but I had to do some welding to mount them. I used the same tubes for the pedals. but fabricated new pedals, that are bigger than the factory ones. Because my feet have slipped off when I didn't need them to and had a few close calls.

[selje]

Re: My hydraulic heel brake system mock up

For those wanting hydraulic brakes on a Taylorcraft. Read the NTSB report below:

http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/GenPDF.asp?id=ANC06CA082&rpt=fi

New Legend Cub with toe hydraulic brakes and nose over.

[fearofpavement]

Re: My hydraulic heel brake system mock up

For those wanting hydraulic brakes on a Taylorcraft. Read the NTSB report below:

http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/GenPDF.asp?id=ANC06CA082&rpt=fi

New Legend Cub with toe hydraulic brakes and nose over.

I read the report and they don't seem to attribute any of it to the brakes. The pilot lost control and the plane nosed over after it left the runway. Not to discount the need to apply effective brakes carefully on a light aircraft like this. I have no doubt I could get our T-craft with hydraulic Clevelands to go on its nose.

[Len Petterson]

Re: My hydraulic heel brake system mock up

Basic hydrualics;

Area Ratio between master cylinder and wheel cylinder.For example if the master cylinder has cylinder diameter of .78" * r2 = 1" and the wheel Cylinder has a diameter of 2" Area = 2 * 2 * .7854= 3.14 ratio is 3.14 = 314 psi if a force of 100 lbs is applyed to the brake pedal
It is better to beat your brains out in math, is when on the dash!(;f Have fun and be safe.Len

[murphy]

Re: My hydraulic heel brake system mock up

I have hydraulic clevelands on my F21A and with the tail planted and the yoke in your belly you can brake really hard without raising the tail. Now don't get me wrong if you stomp and hold them on pavement you will go over. Someone once said on this forum never apply brakes in a Taylorcraft without the yoke all the way back, that is the key.
Mike

[Dusty]

Re: My hydraulic heel brake system mock up

jgerard - very nice. Do you know if F-19 gear will bolt up to a BC12-D?

wlas - was thinkin 'if only that had better PEDALS...' when I got to your post - got pictures??

selge - get an ercoupe.

Blaming functional systems for pilot error is pretty lame, if typical. Brakes should be able to hold the tail up with the stick all the way back OR slide a tire. Anything less means you could have landed shorter if you had better brakes. That's important for some of us.

[wlas]

Re: My hydraulic heel brake system mock up

Dusty,
I'll take some pictures later and post them , also the F-19 gear fit the BC 12 D just fine. What I did was, take some 1 1/2 in axles from some cub gear that was bent and cut them off, slipped them over the old T-craft axle and weld them at the flange. They work great. I 've got a F-19 that I've been kinda parting out, if anyone needs the brake drums, shoes, etc , I have the gear also, but its bent up pretty good.

[wlas]

Re: My hydraulic heel brake system mock up

Dusty, here's a picture, I added two more pictures of the installation, I had to cut an access hole in the bottom of the boot cowl and fabricate a cover for it, its easy to remove an adjust the pedals or inspect. the brake lines are 1/4 alum tubing from the master cylinders to bulkhead fittings and then 1/4 in aeroquip down the wheel.

[N96337]

Re: My hydraulic heel brake system mock up

WLAS, that's more what I'd been thinking of... looks good! I like Jason's as it's easy to install, but I'd planned on hiding the m/c under the floor...
I'm going to 1 1/4 axels and wheels with single puck Clevelands... they're plenty heavy duty and are a bit lighter than 1 1/2", plus I have a set sitting here!!
JH

[Pearson]

Re: My hydraulic heel brake system mock up

Wlas,

How did you attach the mounting plate to the landing gear? Is this an approved installation, 337, STC? Can I get copies of your paperwork?

[jgerard]

Re: My hydraulic heel brake system mock up

Fortunately the F19 gear has a plate welded to the axle for the mechanical Cleveland's that has the same hole spacing as the caliper carrier plate. If you were going to modify a tapered axle up to 1.5" you would need to weld on the mounting plate also. I will have to make a spacer that slides over the axle between the carrier plate and wheel to put the wheel in the right place so the disc lines up just right with the caliper. Not rocket science, I guess thats why my FAA guy said I can continue with the install. There will be a faring to cover the master cylinders up and help keep dirt off them and it should kinda hide the mess between the firewall and brake pedals. I'll paint it black to make it disappear in the darkness under the panel.

WLAS -

Thanks for adding those extra pics. I like how you gusseted the gear leg at the axle along with the traditional "ski brace"

[wlas]

Re: My hydraulic heel brake system mock up

The flange on the PA-18 axels, that I welded over the factory axel is what I mounted torque plate to. I am working on getting them approved, but Its hard to get a chance to work on my own plane when I have everyone else's to work on. The brace I welded on the tie strut, I did many years ago, after I almost had it let go in some deep snow on a river. When I stopped the strut was only holding by a thread. I walked a mile or so to a cabin and the guy had a bottles and a torch. he took me back with a snowmachine and a piece angle that I welded on just to make it home. Its a must for skis.
Larry

[stormman]

Re: My hydraulic heel brake system mock up

why not come up to North East Arkansas and see mine? Cessna tilt peddles etc.

[marc]

Re: My hydraulic heel brake system mock up

howdy all,did any one get there brakes approved yet i would like heel bakes instead of toe brakes marc n43643