Red and Brown; what is this stuff?

[hangarb7]

It is all about “colors” today. Red and Brown.

I have a new potential problem with N44057. It has a Continental 65-A8 and the carb was professionally rebuilt and tagged about 8 years ago by the previous owner. The engine runs perfectly.

However, I have noticed over the past three months (after sitting idle for two years prior) that the bottom of the cowl has a red residue just below the carb intake. It looks just like the old 80 octane red die but I doubt if this carb has had any 80 in it for ten or fifteen years. And why is it appearing now? It wipes off and I can’t see where it might be coming from but I also notice that I got a little red from the bottom of the cold air intake for the carb heat box. I’ve had the airplane for almost four years and that is the first I’ve seen this.

What the heck is that stuff? Are there seals in the carb that are deteriorating?

The second question is concerning my wing tanks. Both of my drain valves have been leaking so I took out the valves to replace them and there is a pretty good quantity of brown (tan) talcum-like powder in the tanks. My airplane is in a closed hangar and I really have no suspicion that it is mud bees or anything like that building a nest in there. Other than that, the tanks look pretty clean inside. By the way, it was in the valves, too so that is why they were leaking.

Is it residue from 100 octane that evaporated? Is it oxidation from the tank? Any good thoughts for sloshing the tanks in the airplane?

Thanks,

Jack D.
’46 BC12D

[fearofpavement]

Re: Red and Brown; what is this stuff?

sound like rust to me. It can take on a number of colors including red, brown, orange and black.

[whake]

Re: Red and Brown; what is this stuff?

Check the screens in your wing tanks, be carefull they are hard to get out you could shear the fittings...use a flashlight and check them from the top.

[hangarb7]

Re: Red and Brown; what is this stuff?

None of the Red or Brown is rust. The Red stuff stained the bottom of my cowl pink, but it wiped off easily with a rag and some 100LL.

The Brown in the tank is not rust either although it may be a form of oxidation. The tanks are aluminum. But usually, oxidation on aluminum surfaces adheres to the surface and sometimes forms little domes of white oxidation. This is loose like talcum and it actually poured out for a second when I removed the drain.

I did not know there were screens in the tank but it makes sense. Wouldn't they be at the outlet of the tank where the fuel line attaches? So wouldn't I have to remove the tank to pull the screen?

I can just not-use the wing tanks, but the red stuff near the carb is bothering me...

Any help is appreciated.

Jack D.
N44057

[dedrekon]

Re: Red and Brown; what is this stuff?

Is this bird new to you? A previous owner could have used Marvel Mystery Oil in the gas (I do) and it WILL stain to those colors if you have some leakiness somewhere.

V

[hangarb7]

Re: Red and Brown; what is this stuff?

I will check out the Marvel Mystery Oil possibility. I'll send him an e-mail now. But I have run about fifty hours of 100LL thru the airplane since I've owned it. Think it would still be there enough residue in the carb if the carb developed a leak?

And the carb leaking. Is that a common thing? I mean, does that mean a teardown or is it just a tighten up the bolts and re-safety?

Thanks.

Jack D.

[Frank DeBartolo]

Re: Red and Brown; what is this stuff?

I heard once upon a time that MMO should be mixed with gasoline in a separate container probably a one gallon container and shaken--to dilute it and tnen installed in the gas tank because if not mixed and shaken it will glob up and settle at the bottom as one MMO glob. If this is true, this could be the culprit. I don't know if there is any validity to diluting and shaking the MMO prior to putting it in with the gasoline--or if it will just dilute by itself when adding to the gasoline. I am not using MMO at this time--don't know if this is an old wives tale or if it is true.

FD
N43684

[stormman]

Re: Red and Brown; what is this stuff?

90% sure im with Fear of P on this one

STILL sounds like Rust to me, maybe not from your planes tank but from the fuel supply source. Do you use cans for refuling? Pickup transfer tanks without a final filter? Or maybe just a rusty FBO tank or your local rusty tank gas station.
They do dye off road diesel red but im not sure on the off road gas.
My only other thought ( yes i do think somtimes) is that someone threw in a can of ATF. or red oil dye looking for a leak.
But if you had the plane for ten years you should know this unless u had a little help from your friends ( enemies , jokesters, got U's etc.) Pick up any good deals on fuel storage tanks lately?
Also i take Salsa to mean a partner dance form that corresponds to salsa music not taco sause, not that you would put either in your tanks im sure. And i bet you have a visual on Muppet..

[hangarb7]

Re: Red and Brown; what is this stuff?

OK, now I'm getting worried.

First, it is not rust. I have not used any refueling cans at all. I have pumped every bit from the same tank at my home airport, all 100LL and it is clear blue. The gascolator is clean.

I spoke with the previous owner and he never used any Marvel Mystery Oil and I believe him. He is a stickler for using what the previous owners to him used, 100LL with no additives and 15W50 Aeroshell, which is what I use.

It is definitely that same bright red that looks like Marvel Oil but again, I've had the airplane for four years and the previous owner had it for 11 or 12 years.

I was really hoping that someone would say, "I know exactly what that is." So that's why I am concerned, if no one here in THIS group has seen it before!

Anyway, it is a red stain that keeps appearing over the last two months on the bottom of the cowl, collecting around the edge of that rivetted-on air cleaner bump at the bottom.

The last thing about rust, in my experience is that is stains paint and is usually difficult to get off when it is dry. My airplane is white so it is not staining the Superflight coating on the cowl.

I think I will visit the hangar and put a clean rag around the carb to see if I can tell where exactly it is coming from. The old girl is trying to tell me something but I can't yet understand. I need a Taylorcraft whisperer

I'm still open to ideas. Thanks for everybody weighing in.

Jack D
N44057
BC12D

[3Dreaming]

Re: Red and Brown; what is this stuff?

I know it's not the same, but on my Cherokee when the quick drain leaks on the wheel pant and dries it leaves a redish brown stain. While the fuel is wet it has the blue color around the wet spot, but it turns brown when dry. Take a rag and wipe inside the vent tube below the carb airbox, and I bet you will get the same stuff.
Now I have know idea about the stuff from the wing tanks. Tom

[Guest]

Re: Red and Brown; what is this stuff?

It is all about “colors” today. Red and Brown.

I have a new potential problem with N44057. It has a Continental 65-A8 and the carb was professionally rebuilt and tagged about 8 years ago by the previous owner. The engine runs perfectly.

However, I have noticed over the past three months (after sitting idle for two years prior) that the bottom of the cowl has a red residue just below the carb intake. It looks just like the old 80 octane red die but I doubt if this carb has had any 80 in it for ten or fifteen years. And why is it appearing now? It wipes off and I can’t see where it might be coming from but I also notice that I got a little red from the bottom of the cold air intake for the carb heat box. I’ve had the airplane for almost four years and that is the first I’ve seen this.

What the heck is that stuff? Are there seals in the carb that are deteriorating?

The second question is concerning my wing tanks. Both of my drain valves have been leaking so I took out the valves to replace them and there is a pretty good quantity of brown (tan) talcum-like powder in the tanks. My airplane is in a closed hangar and I really have no suspicion that it is mud bees or anything like that building a nest in there. Other than that, the tanks look pretty clean inside. By the way, it was in the valves, too so that is why they were leaking.

Is it residue from 100 octane that evaporated? Is it oxidation from the tank? Any good thoughts for sloshing the tanks in the airplane?

Thanks,

Jack D.
’46 BC12D

I find dripping/seeping autogas leaves a stain similar to what you describe.

Of coarse if you do not use auto fuel this will not make sense.

Dave.

[crispy critter]

Re: Red and Brown; what is this stuff?

As someone mentioned before...did you use a flash light to look down inside your wing tanks at the screen where the fuel line goes out. There should be a brass,copper,or steel fine weave screen(kinda like your oil screen but smaller in diameter). If you look and don't see it then you have probably found the problem.If you do see it then try to see if it is rusting or corroding.

[hangarb7]

Re: Red and Brown; what is this stuff?

Hi Kevin,

Since the suggestion was made, I have not been back to the airport to look at the screens. I will certainly do that. I have an inspection pea-bulb light on a cord that I used to check the inside of my homebuilt's tank when I was sloshing it.

But I am curious about your comment that if I don't see the screen then that may be the problem. Are you suggesting that the screen (most I have seen are brass or bronze) corroded to nothingness?

As far as I know, there has never been MMO or auto fuel in my airplane. I find the comment about the Cherokee wheel pant to be interesting. I plan to do some more experimenting with 100LL residue to see if it leaves anything of consequence.

Thanks to everybody. I'll report back. Still like to see if Forrest has a guess on this.

By the way, it is Salsa dancing with my wife that I enjoy. Good exercise and a reason to spend one evening a week with my 29 year bride.

Jack Dernorsek
N44057

[Len Petterson]

Re: Red and Brown; what is this stuff?

The white stuff in the wing tank can be corrosion of aluminium. Drain the tanks completly and check for water. If the previuse owner used Mogas it may have hade ethanole in it and it together with water is not good for the aluminium.
Check for hornets nests in the tanks as well. I found one in mine last week.
The tank most have been e-t for some time.

[crispy critter]

Re: Red and Brown; what is this stuff?

Hi Kevin,

Since the suggestion was made, I have not been back to the airport to look at the screens. I will certainly do that. I have an inspection pea-bulb light on a cord that I used to check the inside of my homebuilt's tank when I was sloshing it.

But I am curious about your comment that if I don't see the screen then that may be the problem. Are you suggesting that the screen (most I have seen are brass or bronze) corroded to nothingness?

As far as I know, there has never been MMO or auto fuel in my airplane. I find the comment about the Cherokee wheel pant to be interesting. I plan to do some more experimenting with 100LL residue to see if it leaves anything of consequence.

Thanks to everybody. I'll report back. Still like to see if Forrest has a guess on this.

By the way, it is Salsa dancing with my wife that I enjoy. Good exercise and a reason to spend one evening a week with my 29 year bride.

Jack Dernorsek
N44057

If you don't see the screen or part of it is gone it might explain the stuff that came out when you pulled the drain plug...I'm not sure about it but it is the only thing I can think of that would give you the color and the rest of the stuff you are desrcibing unless someone has told you wrong about MMO or auto gas.