New member,wood doors

[grandmanancy]

Re: New member,wood doors

there is a set of 1941 t-craft wooden doors
on e-bay. item no. 4619162507.
they look complete,
thought you might be interested.

[mulwyk]

Re: New member,wood doors

Norm:
Please keep us posted on your dealings with FSDO. Also, great interest here on use of T-88 type modern adhesives. Best wishes on your project!

Bob Gustafson

[midniteflyer52]

Re: New member,wood doors

Hi Norm,
I came across a snapshot of your ship next to my dad's 1934 Monocoupe 90A circa 1959 at the Woodstock CT airport. I had several rides in this Tcraft as a small boy. Send me your email address and I'll scan it and send it to you.
Regards,
Glen Brodeur
Putnam, CT

[Ragwing nut]

Re: New member,wood doors

I do not recommend T-88 for any aircraft use. I know of 2 instances where the glue joints failed after a few years. One was a box spar on a homebuilt, and the other was on a unfinished Waco project I walked up to and snap all the glue joints with minimal effort and no damage to the wood. I would use recorcinal, weldwood, or West Systems epoxy with a binder in it. I have used West Systems for 10 years with out a single failure of a joint.

Mike

[N96337]

Re: New member,wood doors

I don't see why you wouldn't want to use the approved glues either... I've seen what T88 does... at about 140 degrees it loses around 70% of it's strength.. According to DuPont, on an 80 degree day, even a white wing can register up to 130 degrees of internal temp.. a black wing at the same temp, shows an internal temp of about 180 degrees... think about it....
Contact a guy named Jeff Morfiit at the Renton, WA ACO, 425-917-6405. He'll tell you all about T88... he's spent alot of time testing it... I stick to Weldwood Resorcinol... it's approved and it WORKS no matter what the temp.
JH

[Norm G]

Re: New member,wood doors

Thanks for the glue input. I agree , the West System and Weldwood looks like the way to go. I visited a guy near by who is restoring a Fairchild, and he recomends the same glues. So Weldwood and the West System will be the way to go.

Thanks N29715

[N96337]

Re: New member,wood doors

Norm, be careful of any epoxy...they aren't approved for certificated aircraft...
JH

[Marv]

Re: New member,wood doors

Has anyone used or checked Titebond 3 out? It may not be approved, but it is waterproof, and I have been told it is a lot better than recorsinol .Thanks Marv

[Big Daddy]

Re: New member,wood doors

I have used Titebond 2 and haven't any problems. Recoreinal on the other i have seen it dried out and nothing the jonts together but the nails

[taylorcraftbc65]

Re: New member,wood doors

Mike,
What do you use for a binder? I'm currently building a Flying Flea, and was getting ready do start construction on the wings. Brie

I do not recommend T-88 for any aircraft use. I know of 2 instances where the glue joints failed after a few years. One was a box spar on a homebuilt, and the other was on a unfinished Waco project I walked up to and snap all the glue joints with minimal effort and no damage to the wood. I would use recorcinal, weldwood, or West Systems epoxy with a binder in it. I have used West Systems for 10 years with out a single failure of a joint.

Mike

[N96337]

Re: New member,wood doors

I haven't seen resorcinol fail...I've seen lots of casein fail just like you're talking about, and I've seen lots of urea-formaldehyde resin glue fail from drying out... My Tcraft spars were a prime example of that...the glue failed everywhere on them... rendering them useless... but at the time, that's what they had to work with, so they did the best they could with what they had. I'm not saying that resorcinol wont fail... I'm sure it does...but all I'm saying is that you don't want to start experimenting with adhesives when you're working on a certificated aircraft... there have been a few grounded, and a few that have some real restrictions placed on their operation from using the wrong adhesives!! When I talked to Jeff Morfit the last time, he told me of a Tiger Moth that had been built, using T88... it wound up with a thermocouple installed in the wing, and temperature restrictions as to when it could fly.. and he said basically if the sun was out, the plane was grounded because of those restrictions.... that would drive me nuts to have put that much work in on something, just to have it restricted that much!!!! I guess the main thing is to work with your local FAA inspector first, then do the work.
Hopefully, the next revision to AC43.13 will have more info for us folks that are still out here working with the GOOD airplanes!
JH

[Ragwing nut]

Re: New member,wood doors

Norm, be careful of any epoxy...they aren't approved for certificated aircraft...
JH

You could self certify glues if you properly test them at one time. And Waco Classic was or is still building new Wacos with West Systems.

Mike

[cropduster]

Re: New member,wood doors

I just finished repairing the wood doors for the 41 Deluxe I am restoring. One wood of advise, make sure you have the curvuture of the door figured out before you glue everything back togeather and especially before you put the inside panel on. I spent a lot of time and money on mine and then when I put them on I had lost a lot of the curvuture to the door and ended up with a 2" gap on the top of the door. I had to soak them in water and try and bend them back into shape. The result is now the inside panel is now warped.

[N96337]

Re: New member,wood doors

I do have a question, and hope it's recieved in the manner it's asked... why would you want to use an epoxy? I'm not trying to be smartalleck or anything, just asking what epoxy does that resorcinol wont...or whatever reason that everyone has for going to epoxy? In my very limited experience with epoxy, I wasn't impressed..it seemed messy, and really didn't do anything outstanding that I could see..so I'm wondering what everyone else sees in it??
JH

[Ragwing nut]

Re: New member,wood doors

Epoxy with fillers can be used for gap filling poorly fitted joints or areas where clamping will be hard. Recorcinal requires a tight joint and clamping pressure to work correctly. I only use epoxy for non-structural applications.

Mike