World lowest time Taylorcraft

[David Price]

Don't quite how to say this, but back in 2002 I bought a '46 BC12D N96045 (formally N95945) and have loving it all too much. Bought it knowing the TT was UNKNOWN, wind damage and repaired, but a nice bird.
After all these years research the records and original owner was student pilot and still student pilot 2 years later.
Wind damage in 1949 and put away for 44 years. Sold as project , not finished sold to another got it ready for ferry flight to shop and put brought back to life in 2000, but carb and mag issues.
Thats when I got it. Award winning aircraft .
Now tach reads 0633.4 ---I have put 520hrs in that time. tach may or may not be original, or installed during rebuild in 93 -95.
How would compute this according to AC 43.9c?

[Guest]

Re: World lowest time Taylorcraft

Hi David,

I don't understand what you are asking.

Here is the reg that you reference.

§43.9 Content, form, and disposition of maintenance, preventive maintenance, rebuilding, and alteration records (except inspections performed in accordance with part 91, part 125, §135.411(a)(1), and §135.419 of this chapter).
...

(c) This section does not apply to persons performing inspections in accordance with Part 91, 125, §135.411(a)(1), or §135.419 of this chapter.

However it ends up referencing this one if you follow the trail.

§43.11 Content, form, and disposition of records for inspections conducted under parts 91 and 125 and §§135.411(a)(1) and 135.419 of this chapter.

(a) Maintenance record entries. The person approving or disapproving for return to service an aircraft, airframe, aircraft engine, propeller, appliance, or component part after any inspection performed in accordance with part 91, 125, §135.411(a)(1), or §135.419 shall make an entry in the maintenance record of that equipment containing the following information:

(1) The type of inspection and a brief description of the extent of the inspection.

(2) The date of the inspection and aircraft total time in service.

I think that you said the airplane is flying (i.e. "in annual") if that is correct then the IA must have already computed the total time in service.

So I am not following what you are asking.

Can you elaborate?

Dave R

[David Price]

Re: World lowest time Taylorcraft

Feds said to reference AC43.9c to reconstruct TT.
According to all info availible info it appears to have no more than 644 - by Tach. But no TT was ever recorded in 1993 .
Is it possible to have this low time?
How would others compute this?

Not concerned for me, am selling it.
Would like to have the books straight.
Than you.

[Mark Bowden]

Re: World lowest time Taylorcraft

Does it still have that “new aircraft” smell? (Ha).

If I understand your post you are trying to note in the logs the aircraft time in service, but you do not have all the logs? Is this correct?

You are right in trying to get the logs accurate as owner, per part 91, owners are responsible for keeping maintenance records, no one else. The owner keeps time in service not A&P or IA’s, they just make log entries as to what was done, how and when.

To what I think is your question, Per the AC43-9C https://www.faa.gov/regulations_poli...cumentID/22587

You are not supposed to use recording time devices like Hobbs meters and tachs to keep time-in-service hours. This is because they only are calibrated at one operating point to match the actual passage of time. The exception is time recorders based on something like a gear squat switch.

In the AC there is a provision for incomplete records. The owner is to research all existing docs from all sources to establish an estimate of time in service. Make a written statement in the log, get it notarized and enter the best estimate in the current aircraft logs.

Reference Section 8 and 12 of AC43-9C.

If you have the all logs and you think the records are just PIC time and your question is how to get to the “letter of the regulation” on logging time in service? You have to make an estimate to get to that value.

Since it sounds like you have flown it about 80% of the time. Maybe one way would be to average your trip time. Then go fly your “average” trip profile, timing your wheels up and down time. Then adjust the total logged PIC time to time in service. Another way would be to just take off 1 or 2 tenths off each flight of PIC time, whatever your typical profile is.

[Guest]

Re: World lowest time Taylorcraft

Does it still have that “new aircraft” smell? (Ha).

If I understand your post you are trying to note in the logs the aircraft time in service, but you do not have all the logs? Is this correct?

You are right in trying to get the logs accurate as owner, per part 91, owners are responsible for keeping maintenance records, no one else. The owner keeps time in service not A&P or IA’s, they just make log entries as to what was done, how and when.

To what I think is your question, Per the AC43-9C https://www.faa.gov/regulations_poli...cumentID/22587

You are not supposed to use recording time devices like Hobbs meters and tachs to keep time-in-service hours. This is because they only are calibrated at one operating point to match the actual passage of time. The exception is time recorders based on something like a gear squat switch.

In the AC there is a provision for incomplete records. The owner is to research all existing docs from all sources to establish an estimate of time in service. Make a written statement in the log, get it notarized and enter the best estimate in the current aircraft logs.

Reference Section 8 and 12 of AC43-9C.

If you have the all logs and you think the records are just PIC time and your question is how to get to the “letter of the regulation” on logging time in service? You have to make an estimate to get to that value.

Since it sounds like you have flown it about 80% of the time. Maybe one way would be to average your trip time. Then go fly your “average” trip profile, timing your wheels up and down time. Then adjust the total logged PIC time to time in service. Another way would be to just take off 1 or 2 tenths off each flight of PIC time, whatever your typical profile is.

Hi Mark,

Good point.

I was thinking the IA computed but you are correct he merely references it.

My bad.

Thanks again, Dave R.

[David Price]

Re: World lowest time Taylorcraft

Thank you all, very much!
I shall comply.

[David Price]

Re: World lowest time Taylorcraft

Thank you all, very much!
I shall comply.

[N96337]

Re: World lowest time Taylorcraft

Is it possible to have this low time?

Sure it's possible!! When my buddy Ken got his Tcraft done and sold it, the total time was about 400+, and just a few more by the time Richard Boyer bought it. It had done what yours had...been flown only a little, way back when, then torn apart and went from owner to owner, never getting put back together. Yours sounds like about the same deal.
John

[LostnSpace]

Re: World lowest time Taylorcraft

Now tach reads 0633.4 ---I have put 520hrs in that time. tach may or may not be original,

the '46 tcrafts i have owned and a few I work on and maintain do not have recording tachs, I'd say the recording tach is not original and TT will be higher

[M Towsley]

Re: World lowest time Taylorcraft

I agree, no recording tachs used on the originals from my experience. (Unless someone has additional info on this). Unless someone happened to put the current hours on the recording tach the TT is somewhat of a guess. My aircraft has had several tach changes. I was the only one who had the new tach hours reflect TT from logs.

[David Price]

Re: World lowest time Taylorcraft

Thank you for all input. Gives a lot to consider.

[NC36061]

Re: World lowest time Taylorcraft

Do you have the document history from the FAA? If not, you can get a CD or hard copy with everything the FAA has received on the airplane since new. There will likely be some documents with recorded TT to help you arrive at an educated guess for reconstructing the current TT.

[David Price]

Re: World lowest time Taylorcraft

Thank you!