STC # SA1-210 is Fully FAA Approved and Available For Sale

[barnstmr]

Here it is! Finally available again from Certified Aeronautical Products.

85 horsepower upgrade for Taylorcraft Models BC and BC12D.

Click the following Text. Or... call (254) 715-4773

STC # SA1-210 is Fully FAA Approved and Available For Sale.

[N96337]

Re: STC # SA1-210 is Fully FAA Approved and Available For Sale

Way to go Terry! Glad to see it went into good hands that will do something with it!
John

[RoN43220]

Re: STC # SA1-210 is Fully FAA Approved and Available For Sale

Great news. Seems reasonable. Other than the obvious power advantage, I'm curious - does an upgrade like this detract from the value in originality of a well kept T-craft? Or is there a net gain in value and, if so, how much would it increase the value of such a plane?

Thanks, Ron

[magman]

Re: STC # SA1-210 is Fully FAA Approved and Available For Sale

My take is it would maintain current value by preventing trees from sticking through the wings!

[mulwyk]

Re: STC # SA1-210 is Fully FAA Approved and Available For Sale

Actually, Ron raised an interesting question. Is the Taylorcraft an antique airplane? It it's an antique, then it has more value in original condition.

Here's an example: my neighbor had a 30's era Ford pickup truck, beautiful, original condition. Everyone admired it, a valuable, running antique. Then a couple years ago, he decided he needed more power and shoehorned in a modern V-8 engine. He made the old truck go fast (and loud), but he's always regretted doing it. He says the hot rod truck is worth half what the original antique truck would be worth today.

Another example: my father had a old Winchester lever action rifle that he used all his life for deer hunting. A beautiful old gun. One day when he was 70 years old, he decided this rifle would be an even better deer hunter if it only had a scope. He took the rifle to a gunsmith and asked him to install a scope on it. Luckily, the gunsmith was a man of integrity and refused to do it. Instead, he gave my dad a lecture about the value of an antique.

My opinion: an antique airplane like a Taylorcraft should be kept original.

[Marv]

Re: STC # SA1-210 is Fully FAA Approved and Available For Sale

If you want to know what is worth the most,m a restored antique car or a strteetrod, check in Hemming motor news. A restored original that you have to spend a fortune for stainlesss trim and antique engine parts is worth about 1/3 to 1/2 less than a stret rod of the same car. I know i have an original 39 Ford and soon to be street rod. I have owned this car since 1963. The stret rod will be dependable and drive anywhere anytime in comfort, and if you do need parts you can buy them anywhere. Marv

[Larry Lyons]

Re: STC # SA1-210 is Fully FAA Approved and Available For Sale

Yep, watch what you wish for! The model T Ford peaked in value about 30 years ago. As the old timers died off the value kept coming down to where it finally leveled out at about half of what it once brought as the demand died. (literally) Larry

[barnstmr]

Re: STC # SA1-210 is Fully FAA Approved and Available For Sale

As the holder of the STC, my opinion doesn't count because I do have a vested interest. But I will add my 2 cents anyway... isn't that what this forum is for?

Frankly, the pros and cons of this modification stand on their own merit and I do not think I have to sell anyone on them. I believe this can be argued both ways with valid points. The decision as I see it just depends on (1) the intended use of the airplane and (2) on the starting condition of the airframe.

(1) Certainly for an airplane owner that needs the added performance or features of a C85 to stay safe, it makes sense. Mountain flying, payload, hand-propping, electrical systems for use of avionics in congested areas... these are all factors to consider. There is no doubt that there are other airplanes that will meet those needs... but from a cost standpoint, the Taylorcraft could certainly fill the need for a lot less money up front than say an equally equipped Champ or other C85 equipped light airplane. So to the guy who has this need, there is more "value" than an A65 Tcraft... but perhaps not as much "worth" as a C85 Champ? This is good to debate!

(2) If I am starting with a basket case and scrounging for enough parts to build up an airplane to begin with, I think it would be a major boost to have the option for other engine choices. Especially to the guy who can scrounge up a C85 and add an O200 Crank for the same or lower cost than to buy and overhaul an A65. On the other hand, there are some cases where the airplane has never been modified far away from its original configuration or is a very low-time airplane. In such cases, the airplane might be valued better than if modified. We have in our family, a low-serial #, good clean, 90% original, solid 1939 BC-65 that I would not apply the STC just because it is a low serial number and has not ever been altered far from its original configuration. Granted, with the 1100 lb. gross weight, this airplane does not have the "legal" utility of other Tcrafts. But I feel it would de-value the airplane's mystique as an antique specimen to convert to a BC12D-4-85 or 19.

Good debate.

[barnstmr]

Re: STC # SA1-210 is Fully FAA Approved and Available For Sale

One important thing I left out... (here comes the sales pitch).

The beauty of the SA1-210 STC is that you can have the performance and other benefits of a C85 without much modification at all. In fact... you really have to be sharp to spot an airplane with the STC mods. If there is ever a desire to take the airplane back to original status, it would not be difficult.

Config. A - the mods to convert from a BC12D to a BC12D-85 all fit in the same package as the BC12D... same engine mount, same cowling, just an engine swap. The wing mods are optional, but still are invisible to the outside. The added power and safety will arguably add value.

Config. B - the mods to convert from a BC12D to a BC12D-4-85 or 19 are more involved, but are still equivalent to a TC certified configuration. When done properly, this STC configuration should be just as valuable to its TC approved equivalent.

[Dano"T"]

Re: STC # SA1-210 is Fully FAA Approved and Available For Sale

I agree with Terry on this....I have 4 Taylorcrafts...2 pre-wars with A65's, 2 - 46 BC12D's one with C-85-8 and one with C-90-12F....If you have ever flown a T-Craft with the Engine upgrade you'll never want to go back...It makes a really good airplane a really great airplane. If you are like Joe sev and want an all original showplane...then stick with the original....an average flyer though will be worth thousands more with the upgrade....take it from me...it makes a great ski/floatplane with either the 85 or the 90

[Larry Lyons]

Re: STC # SA1-210 is Fully FAA Approved and Available For Sale

By the way Terry, I will probably be purchasing your STC just because I want the wing upgrades. Although my bird is close to original it does not interest me to maintain that level of authenticity, however I will keep mods to stuff not visible to the naked eye or that require very minimal changes to the aircraft structure. Larry

[Hank Jarrett]

Re: STC # SA1-210 is Fully FAA Approved and Available For Sale

I agree that modifications are really up to the owner based on what he wants to do with it. The only problem is when you cut up an original part to "improve" it, it is gone forever.
There are those of us who really like to keep everything original and those original, unmodified parts are getting really hard to find. If you are thinking of making changes like putting a bigger engine in your plane, and it makes you modify the cowl (this is just an example), PLEASE let the rest of us know! There are probably LOADS of already modified cowls out here and guys like me who would like to swap. I have those awful cowl bumps on my plane because someone in the past wanted shielded ignition. I have bought several top cowls trying to find a good set of the wrap-around hinges and uncut sheet metal. No luck. I will be making a new top cowl by hand some day in the future. Once you put holes in the cowl, you can't take them out again.
Same goes for any original part. Once it's modified, it is no longer "original" for the "nut-cases" like me.
Hank

[Larry Lyons]

Re: STC # SA1-210 is Fully FAA Approved and Available For Sale

Well as I do not know just what all the STC contains I cannot comment on all of it. But at this point all I think I am modifying is the spar and strut attach fittings. One of the news spars I acquired already had the inserts drilled and installed at the wing attach point. So I am fitting the other spar out the same, however there is no hurry as I still need several ribs. My ribs look like something out of a horror story. Most have the nose ate away and are already spliced in two or more places and are cracked in a few more. The engine mod. is not in my plans at this point, my cowl is not cut and I will not be cutting it either. I like the no bump look and am putting a lot of work in to putting the trim back to what it was. The only outward mod. I am considering right now is the two triangle sky light. I have a mantra; no more then 700lbs. empty, ready to fly. I know I know, why am I putting the heavy trim molding in then? Its a Deluxe and I want her to look the part. By the time I get ready to launch I am betting that there will be LED nav. lights approved for her so I can set her up for twilight flight with very little weight pain! Another mod.I am considering is the STOL fittings (OA: can't think of the name of them)for the wings. Larry

[guns68]

Re: STC # SA1-210 is Fully FAA Approved and Available For Sale

I agree that modifications are really up to the owner based on what he wants to do with it. The only problem is when you cut up an original part to "improve" it, it is gone forever.
Hank

Interesting discussion. I know this is centered around the cowling, but does it apply for the doors as well? I have a '46 that I'm looking to modify the doors to patroller type doors. Should I offer these up to the tribe before I start cutting aluminum?

[Hank Jarrett]

Re: STC # SA1-210 is Fully FAA Approved and Available For Sale

If your doors are original you should! There may be a set of Patrol doors out there the owner doesn't want any more. That makes it a match made in heaven and saves you both some work.
Hank

Got to admit, I have never heard of anyone wanting to get RID of their Patrol doors though. That's what is nice about my 45 doors. They are tube frame and the difference between stock and Patrol is replacing the fabric with Plexi! I can go back and forth anytime. Only problem is I don't think I could get my wife to fly in a Patrol door plane.
One steep turn or hard slip and I might scare her out of the cockpit forever.