Taylorcraft Landing Technique

[Craig]

[QUOTE=Hank Jarrett;68378]I sure wouldn't say you can land a Taylorcraft like a Cub (except maybe that they both end up on the ground). They require different techniques and a Cub technique will put you pretty far down the runway in a Taylorcraft. That doesn't say that one technique of plane is better than the other except that if a Taylorcraft technique is used the T will kick butt against a Cub and if a Cub technique is used on both, the Cub will kick butt.
They are NOT interchangable!
Hank


As someone still learning the various traits of the T Craft I was intriqued by Hanks reference to the Taylorcraft Technique he mentioned in the Cub Vs Taylorcraft thread.

I would be interested in Hank's technique along with any others that would aid in increasing my T Craft skill and knowledge

Thanks
Craig

[cvavon]

Re: Taylorcraft Landing Technique

Air speed control is the most important part of landing a taylorcraft come over the fence to fast and they will float to the next county they can be wheel or three point landed i like three point my self they will fall out from under you when there ready to quit flying so when you get slow be close to the ground or feel the bounce my plane with the bush wheels is all together different it don't bounce the tires changed the angle of attack and the tires get to the runway sooner and i can feel for the runway easier oh with good brakes 2 to 3 hundred ft landings are easy

[jim cooper]

Re: Taylorcraft Landing Technique

I was taught in an Aeronca Champ. The key words the instructor kept saying were: "Don't let it touch down, keep it just off the runway, YES!"....(it would finally stall, stick all the way back and drop onto the runway, sometimes very smoothly. This was in 1954. I found that the ones I've owned, The Champ, The Stearman, The Cub and the Taylorcraft ALL land the same way in a three point landing. If you can land a Champ consistently in a smooth, safe landing, you will land the Stearman the same way and the others as well. I brought all of them over the numbers at 60-65mph. Trim is 3/4 UP. Personally, I keep speed at around 70 in the pattern and usually slip it on final (I like to slip!) and over the numbers at 60. I use a 2000 foot runway with obstacles at both ends. In the T Craft (BC12D) I have plenty of room at these speeds. (I was taught to be able to land from any point in the pattern,engine out.) Notice that I do not mention CROSS WINDS. If its a stiff direct cross wind I use 65 mph and wheel land it, wing low.Above 15mph I stay on the ground. The above also worked well in both a Mooney super 21, and a Mooney 201. Threshold speed IS important! Both the Mooney AND the T-Craft will float more than the others but you get used to it quite quickly.JC

[Pearson]

Re: Taylorcraft Landing Technique

I don't know if it is written in the AIM, or where, but somewhere I learned that the recommended approach speed is 1.3 times Vso. If your plane stalls at 40 mph, 1.3 Vso would be 52 mph. I regularly use 60 mph when I am landing at my home airport because it is almost a 4000 ft runway. But I also land in cow pastures and tight landing strips. When I do that I use a lower approach speed and adjust the point where I cut power to idle based on how high I am and how short I need to stop. I flew into a friends backyard yesterday using 45 mph because one end of the runway was very wet and soft. At that low speed, I just keep the power on until I am within a wingspan of the runway, then cut power as I begin the round out. At the low speed that results just above the runway, the tailwheel will touch down first. I like it that way because it means that when the mains touch, they stay touched. This results in an extremely short ground roll, usually under 150 ft.

[flyguy]

Re: Taylorcraft Landing Technique

The most "tricky" characteristic of the Tcraft wing, I would venture to say, is when one comes in a little too fast, read 60 in mine, and tries to flare. Seems what always happens to me is that I float along at about the height that the ground effect becomes significant. That appears to be about 3 to six feet up. If you have the plane level at that point it will not settle through the ground effect, regardless of what you do. It will just slide along with the control yoke about 3/4 back and then the bottom will fall out.

For years in my other BC12s, when I got in this situation, (if not too high) I would just haul all the way back on the controls just as it dropped and she would plop down pretty nicely. Lately I notice that it is better to do something else as it seems my timing is not as good as it once was. Chuckle.

I used to call that a kite landing, because you are stalled and just generating lift for a second like a kite. If I am not trying to get off at the first turn off I might instead add a little power and do a second flare. Takes more runway, but it allows you to get the plane in a high drag mode without having it drop out from under you. Don't ask me what is going in that situation because I really haven't figured it out.

I know I can drag it in over the grassy area before the runway threshold using some power and land really short. I know on Cessnas for sure you are blowing the flaps. May be the same process in the 12D except blowing the inner part of the wing that normally stalls first.

I know the best landings are when I get it all the way down to between 50 and 55 as I come over the threshold (my stall is 44 with the power off.) One had better be low and past the lights then because it is going to quit flying very soon. Almost always to do this I am dragging it with power the last 100 feet across the grassy area at our airport.
Darryl

[jim cooper]

Re: Taylorcraft Landing Technique

I LIKE what Mr. Pearson wrote. Exactly right. When landing on grass at another airport, part of it near the threshold is sometimes wet. I crank the trim back, come in slower and low as possible, nose high with throttle on some. Once over the threshold, just above the ground, reduce the throttle and drop it on. He stated it much better. JC

[Pearson]

Re: Taylorcraft Landing Technique

It really is a balancing act of many different factors. Obviously airspeed and altitude will always be a consideration. But vertical momentum and how loaded up the wing is are considerations also, as well as power setting, headwind, sink rate, and probably a couple of other things. The trick is to start with something you are comfortable with, and then tweak it a little. Try it in the tweaked mode a few times until you become comfortable with doing it that way, then change one other little item like the angle of the approach, or the airspeed. By constantly tweaking what you are comfortable with, you will expand your envelope or "comfort zone". You have to practice everything that lies within your comfort zone, or it will become uncomfortable. The key is practice.

[M Towsley]

Re: Taylorcraft Landing Technique

Then add a passenger and it changes...for the better, I think.

[TreeTopFlier]

Re: Taylorcraft Landing Technique

...My 12-D just loves to wheel land. It takes a lot more effort to 3-point. A three point landing requires me to hold the wheel all-Tha-way back.
If I relax any back pressure at all, the mains will always touch first. I usually practice 3-point landings when it is calm. If there is much X-wind, I always "wheel" her in. My 12-D is also equipped with a stall warning indicater. (when the hairs on the back of my neck stand up), she is about to quit flying.........a very predictable machine....and a joy to fly..........Wonderful airplane. Don in SC

[Pearson]

Re: Taylorcraft Landing Technique

Yesterday was a such a nice day I took a few pictures of the granite VOR stations that everyone navigates by on days like this. The scenic ones really need to be zoomed in on to be appreciated. The cool air was making the little A65 perform better than usual, which prompted the picture of the panel. I don't usually see 100 indicated, even if I am low on fuel and by myself.

[skyboltone]

Re: Taylorcraft Landing Technique

For those who are unfamiliar with flying in the Portland/Vancouver area, the photos Richard has posted are a sure sign that it's going to rain.

[Pearson]

Re: Taylorcraft Landing Technique

That is a guarantee you can take to the bank.

[Dano"T"]

Re: Taylorcraft Landing Technique

I trim it to 60 on downwind....base at 60 final at 50-55 on normal wind days carry a slight bit of power on final...flare at 50 and it settles right in....if I have 2 on board I use 60 on final and flair at 55. I use the exact same speeds on floats/skis/wheels. There is no difference between landing my Cub and Landing my T-Craft except if you are too fast with the T it will float...the cub is dirty (drag) so it will slow down quicker. My BC12D's both stall at 40...if you are 5 ft above the runway when you hit 40mph a pssst sound and it will drop in...clunk.

[Craig]

Re: Taylorcraft Landing Technique

Thanks for all the info from everyone.

Hope ohters will add there thoughs also

Richard, thanks for the nice pictures.

Craig

[Danny Holder]

Re: Taylorcraft Landing Technique

I tend to use a wheel landing a good bit when space is not a issue. I keep power on with a small blast of power prior to touching mains. Practice a lot of slow flight at attitude to get a feel for slow landing speeds. A good place to make a discovery is when you have about 1000 feet of air under you, not 3 feet.