Back from the Factory

[Ed O'Brien]

I just got back from the T-Craft Brownsville factory. I was there this past Thurs and Fri. April 20th/21st. Harry looks as if he's getting things in order. I saw the new Sport and thought it looked great. Basically it's a BC12D with an 0-200. It's got a much better cowling than the old Ferris made birds and looks just right to me. Shaped and tappered to resemble a long nosed BC12D. The panel looks sharp and the plane's details look crisp. We didn't go flying due to a timing thing with the airport and my schedule.

I think Harry's planning on a big roll-out at the EAA/Oshgosh. What I didn't see were any finished planes, only uncovered but welded fuselages (3 or 4), no new wings, and no new 21 gallon gas tanks. Harry says he'll have a bunch of them done within 90 days. I hope so. Anybody headed to Oshgosh should add to this thread.

The new factory looks great but still there seems to be sorting out of materials and protocols. He mentioned some labor problems, keeping people I suppose and said his solution was at hand by training auto-workers with strict oversight by seasoned airplane builders. It worked well in WW2 when Ford and GM built every plane that made history, so I hope it works here. God knows there's a ton of auto workers available. I think he's still a little short handed but proceeding.

We talked about the T-Craft Cub built like an L-2 with big tanks and maybe a 118HP or 125HP engine. Being from Mile High Denver -- I'd gladly sign up for that one. I'm just waiting for him to show me a little more and make sure that he's handeling his business. I'm cheering for Harry everyday. I know the road he's on has been long, long, and damn long. He seems quite committed and earnest. I'd seen him in LaGrange 14 months ago and think that this Brownsville arrangement still needs tweaking but is close to ready.

I appreciated the time he spent with me and look forward to a progress report soon. Anything I mentioned here that I didn't see might have been because these items weren't laying around the shop, or I just missed them. For detailed information check with Harry or email me.

Once Harry starts moving these out the door, I think they'll be perfect and he's even talking a couple of government contracts too. That kind of thing would give him the legitimacy and boost to get this thing rolling. I hope it works out for him.
With regards;
Ed O'Brien

[mulwyk]

Re: Back from the Factory

Ed:
The labor situation is interesting. How many people did you see there in the factory actually building airplanes?

Bob

[Ed O'Brien]

Re: Back from the Factory

I counted 7 or 8 total (Harry would make that number one more, so 8 or 9 total). Harry said some people were in a meeting. But, I went back 24 hours later and didn't see any more people. There were several offices that obviously had folks working in them. The office lights were on and stuff was on the desks. I can't tell you if those additional unoccupied but obviously used desks and offices were accounted for in the 8 to 9 workers or not. SO there may have been another 2-4 people unaacounted for in this report, but there at the plant somewhere.

It's a big facility, with only about 1/3rd being used right now. That said, there was a similar activity level last year in LaGrange. So I can't vouch for anything more than modest numbers of employees.

The bottom line analysis of this is rather simple I think. If Harry were a scam artist. Harry would have scammed AND scrammed by now. Instead he's, according to him and I believe him, leveraged and mortgaged everything he can to get this factory running. You can't help but admire his committment. This is a remarkable thing we're witnessing, even if it appears to be happening in slow motion. So give him both credit and thanks.

Even if Harry spends another 2 years before the dream of a manufactured plane, from new parts, and with big tanks comes out... it'll be worth it. If he can make planes for the Air Force, you'll knows he's for real too.

We should know more by the EAA and since I'm not going to Oshgosh this year I invite others to follow-up on this report.
With regards;
Ed O'Brien

[mulwyk]

Re: Back from the Factory

Ed:

As a guy who worked most of his life in manufacturing, I was wondering what the "labor problem" might be. Is there a labor shortage in Texas?

The comment about bringing in auto workers caught my attention. Seems a little strange. Maybe the labor problem is a labor union problem?

Bob

[Ed O'Brien]

Re: Back from the Factory

I don't have any idea precisely what Harry meant regarding his "labor issue." It could be so many things: Texas (a right to work state)and Brownsville in particular (a border town that's very much Mexico) don't seem to be rife with Union labor issues. It could be bounced salary checks, poor working conditions (it's dang muggy hot in April - god knows August is worse) , not enough work to employ everyone steadily. Harry is the one who raised the issue. So he seemed not one bit redicent in doing so. Whatever it is, Harry appeared undaunted and moving forward.

Most of the fabrication portion of making these birds is pretty straightforward. Welding, measuring, fitting, glueing, tightening, etc. are not neccesarily IA level work. I worked on the Beech Bonanza line in Wichita as a 19 year old kid. I painted landing gears and tested for freedom of movement after it dried. I'm the worlds least handiest person and left handed to boot. I hope all of the 1970 V-tails I worked on haven't had gear issues. But it was left to an inspector to check my work. They did and I redid what they said.

I'm far from a manufacturing whiz and make no accertion to the contrary. But, it seems OK to me. Call Harry and ask him. Like I said he was the one who brought it up.
The FAA comes in and inspects frequently and I'm sure there's inhouse quality control. The run of material is currently so light that every piece produced could be inspected by 2 guys in a couple of hours and signed off as ready to go... and still have time for a long and heavy lunch. There are many matters for Harry to consider and therefore potential buyers to consider also. I think this is sweating the small stuff. Let's say the total number of employees is 10-15 right now. How many of them are needed to build the 7-10 planes that they have firm orders on in this years production run? I was more troubled by not seeing new wings and tanks. That makes the 4 fuselages just pieces of inanimate sculpture. But as I said before -- these items could have been missed by me and not pointed out by Harry.
With regards;
ED OBRIEN

[CraigH]

Re: Back from the Factory

I was more troubled by not seeing new wings and tanks. That makes the 4 fuselages just pieces of inanimate sculpture. But as I said before -- these items could have been missed by me and not pointed out by Harry.
With regards;
ED OBRIEN

Just curious, were these new fuselages that had been welded together by the factory or old fuselages that had been bought with the original tooling?

As far as the tanks are concerned no surprise there. Back in December of 2003 I was told that the new tank design was completed and was supposed to have had one built by the factory.

[Ed O'Brien]

Re: Back from the Factory

Craig/Bob and gang;
I was told the same thing about the "new tanks" too but that was about a year ago. I don't even know if the Taylor Sport that's on the website and I saw on the shop floor has new tanks or old ones. I was told by Harry that he flew the plane to Florida and made but one stop for fuel. Somebody will need to get out a map and figure the range versus 40 and 20 gallon tanks for that answer.

They had 2 wings laid out and mock-ups of the new tanks for sizing. These tanks were just tacked together. It looked to me as if they were still laying out the manufacturing steps using these mock-ups. The wings they were using were old parts not new. The sheet metal on the tanks was new... but as I said these were tacked together mock-ups. SO my answer to your question is I saw no new sub structures. No new landing gears, tail assemblies, wings, or fuel tanks. I saw no crates of engines from Continental. I saw nothing that said these things are just ready to be assembled and flown around the patch for a sign-off. I can't tell you if they exist, are in pieces floating aorund the shop, or are built and put someplace private to keep them from getting beat-up.

The fuselages could be either old or new. There was a guy working on a jig assembling a new fuselage... was it new tubing or old? I couldn't tell. Harry did say... "He's working on a new fuselage and it takes about a week to build them." I was therefore left with the impression that the items for fuselage assembly had been worked out and were ready to go. There was one jig open and one jig with this "not yet assembled" fuselage being worked on by a guy that really looked like he knew what he was doing.

My point about all of this is simple... someone is going to need to follow-up with a factory visit or Oshkosh. Harry said he'd have both the Sport and an F-22 at the EAA.
I can't tell you if it's new or old parts that they're making them with... but there you have it.

There were several old planes in a seperate hangar that are undergoing rebuilds. I'm sure some of them are owned by folks on this board -- so updates from them would be good also. I know some folks have gotten new parts and found them to be well made. But once again I haven't heard whether they were newly minted or old parts. I think that's about all I know and can report on. I'd urge the
folks that have gotten parts and have planes undergoing rebuilds to report too.
With regards;
ED O'BRIEN

[tim]

Re: Back from the Factory

wow if i new i could get a job there i would gladly quit my job to work there in fact back in late 04 i looked in to it and at my a&p school at the time westwood houston area the laide that help us with finding jobs told me that she had one person from the school work ther but the deal was they were haveing him sign off on parts he did not look at and because of this he did last there but if things are better now i would work there in a heart beat as right now i work at a crapy aircraft seat shop for express jet but the good thing is i started a restoration on my 1948 bc12-d-85 started back in march and i have been iching to build one since early 03 oh and also i was wondering what all parts i can get for my t-craft ??? im going to need a lot of h/w and info for her but any way im out

fly safe

tim tanner

[Ed O'Brien]

Re: Back from the Factory

To all concerned;
Might I add this -- Let's keep this thread as diligent as we can. This is Harry's business and future we're talking about. It's really the future of a plane we all hold dear. I've tried to be as accurate about what I know and don't know and about what I saw in Brownsville.

Hear-say, speculation, and airing of old grievences will serve no purpose now. Personally my opinion of what I saw was good but reserved and tempered for performance that is ongoing. Even if Harry doesn't make it to Oshkosh with echlons of planes and glorious news... the fact that he's sweating it out everyday, working through the issues, learning all he can, improvising as neccessary, taking on one gut-shot after another headache, and working along side his family who's pouring-in their best efforts too... is worth our dedication to the truth and respect for his efforts.

I told Harry either he's a damn fool or a genius and he'll
make the difference on his own legacy. Really it's on his shoulders not ours. Good for Harry will be good for us. I've started and run many a fine business... it ain't easy. It ain't easy, one moment of any day you do it.
With regards;
Ed O'Brien

[Steve Pierce]

Re: Back from the Factory

Tim, You need to come up to Gaham and check out my shop. Luscombe, Stearman, Clipper, Pacer and Stinson projects going on and that doesn't include the Champ, Taylorcraft and Clipper that we are doing for ourselves.

[Yellow Duck]

Re: Back from the Factory

Hate to burst ED's and everyone's bubble, but sounds like same old shit. Same Harry. Saying the same thing he has been saying since i gave my deposit two years ago. Hasn't changed a thing. Will believe it when I see real people flying NEW Sport T-Crarfts.

WHERE IS GRAHAM TX???

[CraigH]

Re: Back from the Factory

Lee, you took the words right out of my mouth . Graham is about 60nm WNW of Ft. Worth. If you ever make it out this way give me a call. Lunch is on me.

[Steve Pierce]

Re: Back from the Factory

Graham is 90 miles west of Ft. Worth.

I was at the Legend Cub facility in December of 2004 when the first fuselage was coming out of the fuselage jig. They had 2 airplanes at Sun and Fun 4 months later. Went out to their facility again last summer and was quite impressed with what they had built basically from scratch and a few drawings. I think they have delivere 20 some odd airplanes. Great folks who love what they do and it shows. They even give free instruction to their employees, all they have to do is pay for the gas.

[Yellow Duck]

Re: Back from the Factory

Steve:
Sounds like old time aviation. Isn't that great. But the cost of a new Legend is still way out of my price range. Altho, I do have a friend here that has one due to be here the first of June, with float fittings. He has a PA-18 Super Cub, but now want to get inot the "Sport License" ranks. Ex airline pilot, but has had some problems and doesn't want to fail his medical.