Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Welding: for your consideration

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Welding: for your consideration

    I"ve been asking around various lists in prep for starting O/A
    welding. Would like to hear your comments on one person's input.
    I had just explained that I had found a dumpster with lots of 1/8"
    scrap, just right for learning the basics:

    "1/8th inch is fine for farmers but you'll be farther ahead if you go
    down to Home Depot and buy a couple of 10' lengths of electrical
    conduit. The thin stuff (I think that's all Home Depot sells) has a
    wall-thickness of about .047" -- close enough to the most common sizes
    of tubing used in aircraft (ie, .035 & .049). Once you get the hang
    of it, pick up some scraps of exhaust pipe tubing, which is usually
    .063. What you need to learn how to do is to control the heat of the
    weld well enough so that you can do a basic cluster.

    EMT (ie, 'Electrical Metallic Tubing') is coated with zinc
    (galvanising), epoxy and all manner of other junk. Cut the 10' pieces
    into 1' coupons (ie, a 'coupon' is piece of metal used in a training
    environment). If they're coated with clear epoxy, fire up your
    barbeque, get a good bed of coals, and throw the coupons on the grill.
    Close the thing up (aluminum foil will work) and forget about it. But
    don't breath the fumes.

    While you're at Home Depot, go over to the paint department and pick
    up a couple of quarts of Jasco 'Prep & Prime,' which is a phosphoric
    acid solution. Get a PLASTIC pail, dump in the acid and stand your
    coupons in the acid. If the metal is not sealed with epoxy you'll end
    up with a flat gray, zinc-free surface. Water above 200 degrees F.
    will neutralize the phosphoric acid (ie, bring a bucket of water to a
    boil, drop in your coupons). "1/2 inch" EMT is a nomenclature, NOT a
    dimension. OD is something like .772 (but measure it; the spec isn't
    very tight).

    Since 1 Jan 2000 EMT is no longer marked as such and is in fact basic
    welded structural tubing. (Before, the alloy used in EMT had a fairly
    high lead content to facilitate bending, but the lead not only
    weakened the tubing, it was an environmental hazard. Modern-day EMT
    uses a new ASTME alloy, slightly superior to SAE 1025 in both strength
    and formability. Although the Big Foots still frown on making
    airframes from the stuff, since the spec changed in 2000 there's no
    engineering basis not to use it; it's just plain old fashioned mild
    steel tubing.

    For practice welding rod, try bailing wire (!), also available at Home
    Depot. Go back to where they have the concrete, ask for a roll of
    'tie wire.' Five pound roll is about a buck. (If you ask for bailing
    wire they'll direct you to the Yuppie Tool Department where they'll
    expect you to pay $5 for one pound of 'Utility Wire.' Your mileage --
    and prices -- may vary.)

    Bailing wire is coated with graphite and oil. So wipe it off. Then
    clean up the piece you're using with some CLEAN steel wool."

    Comments appreciated - Mike
    Mike Horowitz
    Falls Church, Va
    BC-12D, N5188M
    TF - 14954

  • #2
    Re: Welding: for your consideration

    Sounds like the man knows metal and how to save bucks.
    Darryl

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Welding: for your consideration

      Originally posted by flyguy
      Sounds like the man knows metal and how to save bucks.
      Darryl
      Couldn't it be a gal? - Mike
      Mike Horowitz
      Falls Church, Va
      BC-12D, N5188M
      TF - 14954

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Welding: for your consideration

        Mike. Get a book on welding like WELDING BASICS by Finch/Monroe. You need to read it.

        By the way I spent a fair amount of time explaining how to trailor a Taylorcraft on another of your questions. Did you read it?

        It looks as though you have moved on now to welding questions. Have you moved the plane to where you are now going to start welding on it?

        Just wondering.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Welding: for your consideration

          Mike:
          Your friend is right. 1/8 inch stock is too thick for aircraft welding practice.

          But golly, Mike. My wife thinks I'm the cheapest guy on earth. Not true. Your welder friend is. Bailing wire welding rod? Electrical conduit with the zinc burned off? Pleeease!

          Drop down to your local farm supply store and pickup a pound of 1/16 inch copper coated gas welding rod and while you're there get a few lengths of thin wall mild steel tube and some 1/16 X 1" flats. You'll pay less than $20. And you don't have to clean bailing wire or burn poisonous zinc on your barbeque grill.

          The hardest part of learning gas welding is learning to get the heat just right so you melt the base metal but don't melt a hole in it. You're going to want consistant known quality materials for your practice or the process will be very frustrating.

          I started with a couple of welding books I got from the library and the EAA aircraft welding video tape. Instead of just welding coupons together, I practiced doing the weld repairs described in AC43.13.

          It took about 20 hours of practice to teach myself to do an acceptable weld (well, most of the time anyway!)

          Bob Gustafson
          Bob Gustafson
          NC43913
          TF#565

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Welding: for your consideration

            Originally posted by Jim Herpst
            Mike. Get a book on welding like WELDING BASICS by Finch/Monroe. You need to read it.

            By the way I spent a fair amount of time explaining how to trailor a Taylorcraft on another of your questions. Did you read it?

            It looks as though you have moved on now to welding questions. Have you moved the plane to where you are now going to start welding on it?

            Just wondering.
            I got Finch out of the library and have been poring over it; ordered 'Aircraft Welding' by L.S.Elzea. Not that I expect to touch a certified a/c with a torch, but I'd like to learn, so ... .

            Thanks for the info on trailoring a Tcraft; yep, trying to absorbe different methods for solving the problem.

            Plane is still at Altoona; the welding thing is just a side issue which started with my question about two months ago about building shielded sparkplug cups. Things get out of proportion with me in a hurry. - Mike\

            PS - I find a/c ownership is just the entry point into learning a whole lot of other things.
            Mike Horowitz
            Falls Church, Va
            BC-12D, N5188M
            TF - 14954

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Welding: for your consideration

              Sometimes the local community college or high school Vo-tech programs have evening classes on welding. If you haven't used oxy/acetylene tanks before there are procedural safety issues. Just for practice and when welding light duty stuff on the farm I use coat hangers for rod.
              20442
              1939 BL/C

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Welding: for your consideration

                Originally posted by Howard Wilson
                Sometimes the local community college or high school Vo-tech programs have evening classes on welding. If you haven't used oxy/acetylene tanks before there are procedural safety issues. Just for practice and when welding light duty stuff on the farm I use coat hangers for rod.
                Howard - I took welding in college, so I expect the basics to come back readily. If you need some, I now have about 5 lbs of slightly oily 'tie wire' you can use in place of the coathangers

                Seriously though, it would probably be easier to simply order the scrap from Spruce then to go thru the 'clean the conduit' route. - Mike
                Mike Horowitz
                Falls Church, Va
                BC-12D, N5188M
                TF - 14954

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Welding: for your consideration

                  EAA has weekend welding seminars that are designed for aircraft welding. Lots of good practice and advise.
                  Jerry in NC
                  TF# 114
                  Prior BC12-D's
                  N43433
                  N95823
                  N44024

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Welding: for your consideration

                    Originally posted by selje
                    EAA has weekend welding seminars that are designed for aircraft welding. Lots of good practice and advise.
                    Yes they do. Unfortunately, the next one is in a galaxy far, far away (actually Colombus, OH in Oct).

                    Looking thru the syllabus and the books I've got, I should be able to learn some, then go see the local EAA chapter tech guy and get him to critique my work. - Mike
                    Mike Horowitz
                    Falls Church, Va
                    BC-12D, N5188M
                    TF - 14954

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Welding: for your consideration

                      Mike; it sounds like the tribe has you started well, after you get going on this trade don't forget to destroy as many of your practice works as possible no matter how proud you are of them.........By doing this you'll get a great feel of what is needed internally for a good weldment. pretty soon they'll simply twist into gross shapes and the welds will hold.

                      Comment

                      Working...
                      X